Quin

I've really grown to love this forum. Most of the other forums I'm on, there's a great deal more homogeneity. Here... On one thread I'm throwing my arms around someone and jumping up and down agreeing with them, and then on another thread absolutely disagreeing with them on every point, with my eyeballs rolling so far back into my head I'm practically seizing. I like that. A lot. It wakes me up. Maybe because, while very active, it's still a fairly small forum. With, what, 20 some odd regular posters, and double that intermittent ones... There aren't the groups that form with A-group all taking this stance, b-group that stance, c-group that other one. So instead of people just toeing party lines, one gets a real,sense of diversity. As everyone outlines their own particular views. Here, people are very rich. Very true to themselves. On some issues E, P, V are in total agreement. In the next its E, A, M, ...& P, B, J, ...& V, C, L. All 3 in disagreement with each other, and agreeing with people they disagreed with in another thread. It's like the anti-clique. Super rare in Internet-land. More commonly, people self select into groups where everyone agrees on most things, and chase out those who don't. Some posters almost unilaterally disagree with each other. But when they do agree, no bones about it, they agree. And vice versa. Those that are almost always in sympathy with each other, will diverge on issues, clearly and honestly. Both of which is even rarer. It's this fascinating dance to be able to watch, learn from, and be a part of. A real gift. There are brilliant & fine minds, generous hearts, and strong spirits here. Good people. Really, really good people. That I agree with, disagree with, and vice versa... But bottom line have really learned to very much respect each and every regular-intermittent poster, here. Whether we agree or not. This time, next, or nearly never. All y'all make me a better person. Q

Me, too. LOL. Right down to the 3 jobs! Granted, my marriage was bad, my kids aren't grown (but the ones I did kinship providing for are back with -healthy!- parents 3,000 miles away, and my own I only have part time.). I just die inside when it's just me. Not that anyone knows. It's not depression, or moping, or bitterness. It's more Rudyard Kipling.. THE WOLF ``Now is the Law of the Jungle---as old and true as the sky; And the wolf that shall keep it may prosper, but the wolf that shall break it must die. As the creeper that girdles the tree-trunk, the Law runneth forward and back--- For the strength of the pack is the wolf, and the strength of the wolf is the pack.'' I work hard, remember to eat -even if I don't cook, I love cooking, but not for myself-, am generally happy-looking... But the vivacity, sparkle, and drive from life is just gone. I'm not the kind of person who is meant to be on their own. It's vexing, and galling, growing up with the ethos that I "should" be okay on my own. But that's the best I am. Okay. Not my best. Not by a long shot. A totally pale imitation of my best. Music helps. Animals help. I'd like to get back into working with horses. You're never alone when you've got a horse to lean on. Teddy Roosevelt said that there's something about the outside of a horse which is good for the inside of a man, and I have no idea why it's true, but it is. Friends honestly make things worse in many ways, since I can't take them home & cuddle them. Except when I can. And for a short period of time I have someone to cook for, and laugh with, and roughhouse with, and share time with. But then we go back to our lives, and their loss is felt more keenly. So I'm a bit gun shy about getting too involves socially, even though I'm a social person. Books & Movies help. Work helps. Internet forums help. LOL. I'm in here intermittently. Generally when Im in hotel rooms. But the people here make me think. I need that. Travel helps. My work at present means travel about 50% of the time. New places turn my brain on. At home I'm often stuck on autopilot. Autopilot kills me more than loneliness. Tylenol helps (I forget, but being alone actually gives me a headache, so sometimes my total lack of motivation can actually be solved by fixing the dull ache behind my eyes, or in my neck). I can't do scripture study on my own (just the way I am, I've tried. And. Failed. A lot.) ... , but I can chat with HF & the Spirit on my own. That helps. Especially at night. All kinds of things help. But in the past several years of being mostly alone, I haven't found anything that fixes. I've toyed around with the idea of going back to active duty, or camp counseling at risk youth... Some kind of 24/7 job. But either would mean losing the time with my family that I do have. And, quite frankly, I'm getting too old. So I'm going to need to find something else. <laughing> My family has a saying "going nowhere fast" (coupled with "I don know where I'm going, but I'm making good time!"). I often think of my life this way, right now. I'm very busy. But it's all treading water. I could wish that it wasn't. But I have come to learn, that on my own, that's the best I can do. Kill time. Some people are good on their own. I'm not one of them. After a bad marriage, though, I'm not willing to repeat that mistake. Better a shadow of myself, than that. But that's part of what makes loneliness so hard... Because not only do I miss people, I miss myself, who I am when I'm around the right people. Q

I grew up in an area where "No Americans" & "No White, No Foreign" signs were on shop fronts, restaurants, medical clinics, post offices, preschools, apartments. Even in places without signs, you could stand and wait for hours while everyone who wasn't you got served first. No, no, you were welcome but the person who came in an hour after you is more important. You want. You wait. "Decent" people will be seen first. And if you press, then you won't get helped at all, and the police will be called. Yes. Asking "Excuse me, please? How long?" Is considered threatening and abusive, and means you've just lost your chance to buy milk. Or gas. Or get the gash in your child's arm stitched up. Later, in an area where black people had the same kind of discrimination. I've worked for many years in places I'm not allowed to order food, or buy groceries, or books, newspapers, etc. in many if not most shops & cafés. Nor lease a car, or apartment, or hotel room, or even hire a cab. (Because I'm female, and women are not allowed, or it's up to the owner if they want to allow women, and those who attempt to do these things will be chased off, beaten, &/or arrested and beaten). I hate seeing the same attitude here, in this country. Discrimination makes me very sad. Q

Our ward hosts one in the apartment cabana where the missionaries & several members live. It's open to anyone who wants to come, although 2 families "host"/ rotate through about 2 dozen families making sure someone is there (around holidays it gets pretty sparse as people head home to visit). Everyone pot lucks. The announcement for it is in the RS binder (along with other meet ups, like the lunch'n'play, pool parties, as well as RS committee stuff like temple night & e service auction). Don't know about the guys' side. Q

I guess that depends on your definition of fun, pleasure, and enjoyment. Outside of the LDS church, I've never met a group of people so focused on having fun. Whether it's cleaning up after a disaster, getting kids eyes to light up as they're learning something new by making it exciting, bringing what joy they can in times of grief, making friends with strangers to go do a sport or help get a broken car out of a ditch, or devoting their lives to a loving god and making the world better. The "I'd love to!" Attitude manifest in every area of their lives that they can make it. Dissipation, debauchery, drugs, et al are about misery. At least in my book. They're not fun. Not happiness. Hedonism is about happiness. So it really depends on your definition of what makes you happy. Q

I suspect the tanks &/or armored personnel carriers are for dealing with gangs & cartels & the like that use armor piercing rounds, as well as for single shooters with high velocity rounds (aka snipers). Body armor just doesn't stand up to target rounds someone has filed into a pointy-point, much less professional rounds. Which gangs and cartels and individuals have and use. In order to subdue a drug house shooting those rounds, one has to actually get officers in range (if they don't just want to kill everyone from a safe distance, which they don't). Which means some serious armor plating to get close enough for less lethal options. Q

I personally know - 3 completely evil cops. - Dozens of jerks - Hundreds of really amazing men & women Which is a pretty exceptional curve. But it also stands to reason: It's HARD to get on most police forces. There is extensive testing, not just to earn the right to attempt to qualify, but then also once one does qualify. Entrance testing. Academy testing. Rookie/probationary periods of 1-3 years. Promotion testing. One has to constantly prove ones self. And, like in medicine & air traffic control, your past counts for squat. Each new day, your head's on the block. I grew up military, which is a quirky thing In the military, you know you're going to be killing pretty decent people (the "enemy" is usually a guy you'd BBQ with, and let watch your kids, in a different time&place). Police, otoh, you know you have to protect the worst of the worst. I spar, time to time, with some LEO friends in super slow-mo/ tap out . Because my training kills and maims fast-fast-fast (we go for eyeballs and throats, groins and joints) while their training is increasing levels of force designed NOT to cause damage. It's super fun. Because I'm actually trying to kill them, while they attempt to restrain a person trying to kill them. Good training for both of us. Completely down and pinned by 3 guys I can still head but (to get my arms or torso released - it's practically impossible to fold onto someone when your world explodes in lights and blood as your nose/jaw/cheekbones break) and then can get the other two off super fast, if I bend at he waist and go for their guns, instead of trying to get away, so they have to roll away to keep me from their weapons. All it takes is Brian leaning down too close to read me my rights, or ask if I'm okay if I start faking an asthma attack. Haha. Got him! (Light tap means he has to let go, because IRL, I've just broken his face). They deal with this kind of stuff all the time. With people hopped up on either drugs or adrenaline (which really can lift cars off people, much less cops), so they feel no pain and have super-strength. In addition to having to try and protect someone trying to kill you, and protect everyone else around them... They also have well intentioned idiots (like this guy who are totally within their rights to be walkin around with an assault weapon open carry, but the police would also be completely STUPID not to stop and ascertain if dude carrying an assault rifle downtown is emotionally disturbed / about to start shooting people, or has a safe/well maintained weapon (people often smith their weapons in such a way they become very dangerous, like hair triggering). As I've said... I know 3 completely evil cops, and dozens of jerks. I don't have stars in my eyes surrounding LEOs. But just because there are bad apples out there, it doesn't follow that the whole system is bad. Q

There are a lot of different kinds of faith... Although I'd say eh fall into 2 main categories: Learned & Blind. Blind faith is fairly rare. Most people use some kind of learned faith. Meaning it's happened often enough that you have faith it will happen again. Even though you have neither proof, nor guarantee, that it will. Here's a sciency example of faith: Every single time you've gotten sick, you've gotten better. Which I know, because you're here. So, even though the next cold you get COULD kill you, I'd lay money that you expect to live through it. That's learned faith. You believe in something that you have no proof for. *** The 2 examples you gave: babies in Medschool & not working on Sunday may or may not be examples of faith. For example, I've worked while in school, and had babies in school, and babies while working (aka I've 'done it all')... And PERSONALLY... It's a heckuva lot easier & less expensive to do babies & school. Why? Because you're not in school for 50 hours a week (aka don't need to fund childcare full time), what childcare you do need is subsidized-so you can afford top notch childcare, and you can study while they sleep.. For me, it's the DREAM work-from-home job that SAHMs are always looking for. I love it. Others would hate it. So Baby in Medschool COULD be super hard, or it could be absolutely perfect. Depends on the family. Would I be willing to have a baby in Medschool? Yep. Because I have faith BECAUSE I've had babies while in school before. I've never been in Medschool, so it might be misplaced faith, but I still believe it could not only work, but work well. Same token, not working on Sundays. It could be a faith thing... But people also prioritize not to work on Saturdays for dance, or Tuesdays for soccer. People prioritize their lives differently. I may look for work that doesn't work on Sundays... But I don't. Not for a lack of faith (I get to visit wards all over the country/world because I work weekends!), but rather the inverse. My faith leads me to work weekends. So... While the person USING the example (Medschool, or never working Sundays) may see it as an expression of their faith (and it durn well is, if they say so) it isn't universal. Some people choose to wait to have kids due to their faith, and choose to work weekends due to their faith (I have perfect faith that I'll either be able to attend as a visitor, or that HF understands when I have to miss...perhaps ironically, I tend to miss church more often at home than on the road). Anyhow... Point being: Not only are there different kinds of faith, but different expressions of it. Just because one thing is an example of faith for one person, doesn't mean that your own faith is less for doing something differently. Q

I have to agree with hedonism Utah is one of the only places (outside of a military base) where I can stick my head into a room full of strangers (restaurant, gas station, etc.) and ask if anyone wants to go do XYZ... And get at least half a room of volunteers. With bright/eager faces and fist pumps, even. I love Utah. In no small part, because total strangers will jump to their feet and go halfsies (or 1/5th, 1/10th, etc) on renting a boat, dune buggy, rapelling equipment, etc. and a whole party is made with people shaking hands and introducing themselves to everyone else in the parking lot. While hedonism often gets coupled with vice, vice isn't fun for everyone. The ability to make anything, no matter how awful, fun ... And the desire to have fun whenever possible.... Is both a military habit, and an ethos I've found in most parts of Utah. Q

I hire out electrical. Too many firefighter friends. Too much self awareness (electricity and I should never be crossing swords). Aside from that... If I don't know how to do it, I generally trade a fifth of nice scotch + dinner to one of our local contractors to "teach" me how. (Meaning sit and eat pizza or ribs, risotto, whatever... and tell me what I'm doing wrong/ what tricks will make something fast or smooth -like building a spacer for keeping fence slats parallel, so you only have to level the first one/ ... just generally laugh at me being all awkward. Win/win.). So for $50-$100 I save between $500 & $5,000. At this point, I can fix most things that go wrong. From snaking a side sewer & replacing burst pipes, to leaky roofs, holes in drywall, laying hardwood, taping and mudding, fridge & dishwasher clogs, squeaky boards, insulating, all that jazz. And if I can't fix it, I can usually learn how to. I like knowing how things work. Q

It also delays making it real. The military forces you to go home when close family dies, except for rare instances, so you can break down there, instead of in the field (also lowers alcohol related & weapons incidents). AMP, Q

You & Pam seem to share an idea/theme here that I don't fully grok. Maybe because I've only been around a few years, so I don't have a good comparison between lately & before. So, if you've got the time, could you expand on that? Ditto! I see a lot of the opposite: people following even though it's not what they believe... Or questioning in order to find common ground to settle perceived problems ... To either change their belief or alleviate their problems with what's been handed down. But I live in a microcosm of who I know. So, like with Eowyns, I'm a little baffled/curious and would like to understand better. Thanks! Q

Nope. At least not in my opinion. Q

I respect the office, if not the man. I believe it to be incumbent on each of us not to follow blindly, but to actively choose what is right. AKA, using our agency, instead of just handing it over. There are some things I go along with, even though I do not agree with them (modesty standards are a good example). There are some things I go along with, that I do not like, even though I agree with with them (the law of chastity is a good example). There are some things I have absolutely no opinion on whatsoever. (Lots!) There are some things I ardently support. (Even more!) And there are some things I absolutely disagree with, and will neither sustain, nor let stand. (I reported one particular bishop who was counseling a battered woman in my DV group to submit to her husband and repent to the Stake Presidency, and had a shouting match with him in the hallway.... As an example.) I believe HF gave us these brains, and hearts, and spirits to USE. I may not always be right, but I am of the opinion that I would rather explain why I acted come judgement, than why I did nothing. "Just following orders" sticks in my craw. Q

Chiming in a bit late: Some GPS devices are better than others, most in modern phones are accurate to within about 10'. What you can do with your child's cellphone in monitoring-land: Tracking APP... Sends real time location on map of phone at all times. Will also store information to play back at later time. Clone it... To have full access to every call/text/app/data usage. Either in real time, or record to go over later. Individual things if you don't want to fully clone: Key-logger... To know everything typed into the phone VAR ... Voice activated recorder Q

ROFL.... Not me! I'm actually far more reserved on here than in real life*. ADHD = Decades of becoming used to being willing to say anything, any time, to anyone. Q

Be careful with that. - Above 4k is in the toxic range for D vitamins. Generally it leads to hyperkalcemia, which means calcium deposits in your organs doing damage (also quite painful, kidney stones are an example). - D vitamins are fat soluable. So instead of excess levels being peed out, they store in your fat. Which makes toxic levels difficult to deal with, and weight loss potentially very dangerous (as when fat burns, it releases all of its fat soluble chemicals into the bloodstream & surrounding tissues... This is why "are you now, or have you ever worked in drycleaning" pops up as a question in physicals & gym memberships. VitaminD toxicity rarely kills, although calcium deposit in your organs can become very serious, but the chemicals from dry leaning are a lot more toxic). - There have been numerous studies done on D vitamins, with most of the health claims surrounding them proven as false. Nutritional supplements are NOT monitored by the FDA (instead they count as beauy products) so manufacturers can write whatever they want about them -true or not, and need no studies to back up their claims. (And, yes, they do get sued all the time... Think of Airborne who had to pay out over $30 million in damages & for making false claims, and Zicam whose zinc based formula Permenantly damaged or destroyed people's sense of smell who have paid out 12 million to date, and have hundreds of lawsuits still in process). Lots of studies have shown that people, especially in northern & urban areas are almost epidemically low in vitD, And low D has been linked to SADD and other issues, but mega-dosing, especially with fat solvable chemicals, is a risky thing to do. Few people get vitD toxicity, as you have to supplement it in order to do so, your body won't over create it from sunshine. So be VERY careful supplementing it!!! ____________ I come from a medical family, and have worked in healthcare. I've never heard of taking vitD for immune function. To the best of my knowledge... The reason doctors (and nurses, admin, etc.) don't catch everything they come into contact with is - Universal Percautions - The same reason teachers don't: they already DID. For the first couple years they were sick almost constantly (often 300 some odd days a year), so their immune systems have antibodies for most of the common ailments floating around. Our antibodies are good for most minor mutations, so once you've caught all 57 of the common cold strains in your area your first 2 years practicing (or teaching) #7b & #51m that's going around this year, you caught back in residency. #58-62 you manage to duck by gelling in and out, gloving between every patient, and not staying in an enclosed space with them for more than a minute or two (and masking if you need to stay longer). It's hard to catch what you don't breathe, and don't touch. all my best! Q

Don't mind me whilst I drive my zamboni through the holes in zaht argument. (Cough) Medically Monitored (Cough) Suicide = Bad (Cough) As opposed to self medicating with alcohol? (Cough) the rest of the country also takes antidepressants ... Although most require one to stop drinking. Seriously, though, the choice to seek help is hard enough for most people. Let's not add to the stigma that contributes to people killing themselves out of despair, rather than seeking help. Q

I respected my husband when I married him. Why did I stop? Indifference, unkindness, cruelty. Broken promises. Lies. Abuse. And then the cycle of abuse. Where I'd forgive him, and believe him, and then he'd just do it all over again. Breaking trust. Each time forgiveness took longer. Less trust was given. Less respect available to be earned. (If he'd made an honest go of it, in time he could have earned it all back, but there was never enough time between his episodes to allow things to heal.) Granted, my ex thought I lost my respect for him arbitrarily. Because, clearly, it was my fault I made him mad, which -of course- makes him lose his temper. Just like our son waking up in the middle of the night sick, made him get less sleep, which made hi pick him up and throw him against the wall. And if I hadn't phoned the police, and thrown him out for doing that, and just let him get a full nights sleep... Then I might "deserve" to be treated well. Yah. Divorce is a wonderful and beautiful thing. Q

Ditto. Magic Blankets. Q

Fully upfront, I haven't real the article, yet. But "Do women feel their husbands need to earn respect before they give it?" Got an immediate knee jerk response : Only once they've lost it!!! Q

Mmmm....things that make me feel good: Shooting (can't hit what you're aiming at all worked up!) Riding (there's something about the outside of a horse which is good for the inside of a man) Surfing & Sailing (balance) circus sports, (either flying or falling. Both fantastic) massage, (mmmmm....mmhmm......oh yah) sushi, kebabs (more, please) Bad Habits? Paying for things that make me feel good! Also injuring myself (why I quit running when angry), and paying for my orthopedic surgeon's boat! Q

Ditto. My understanding is that tithing is due to HF, not the church itself per say. (Not that we EVER debate tithing ; ) It sounds to me like this couple is making a spiritual and wholehearted effort to do their best both to HF & to themselves/each other with their planning. Whether they take 10% of their increase and split it equally between their two faiths! or keep finances separate and have Mrs. tithe on hers to her church, and Mr. tithe on his to his church... They're still following Gods law. Q

I was offered one the same day I was baptized. Something I've learned about the church... If it's something you're interested in... Ask. This bloke Rob and I were baptized the same weekend. Someone asked me about a limited recommend, someone else asked him about a patriarchal blessing. The same sort of thing has happened numerous times to us (and from what I gather, to others). It wasn't that either of us were being snubbed, or forgotten, or were felt more or less worthy. It's just that it happened to be on someone's mind when we were standing there in front of them. The worst thing that has EVER happened to me when I ask leadership about XYZ, is that I get the information of what I have to do first, or what needs to happen. Which is a awesome. Because then I know. Best case, of course, is getting what I want. But a VERY close 2nd is knowing the steps I need to take to achieve what I want! Q

Any time you have to lick your fingers off while eating is a good thing! Egg yolk on sarnies Carolina BBQ Ribs Kalbi short ribs Biscuits and Gravy Buffalo wings Pie Boston Creme Donuts Hmmm.... Apparently licking your fingers off should also be a trigger for heading to the gym. Q