Ferguson Fury

[Gretchen]

This is really disheartening. An 18 year old man was killed after an altercation with the police, not even an hour after he robs a convenience store. His family is calling for justice, and is protesting, saying that he was an awesome man who wanted to go to college.

 

Thoughts?

[Just_A_Guy]

Lots of axes to grind on this.  I think we need to wait and see--there's just a lot of conflicting testimony and it will take time to sort through it all.  Some say the officer was aware of the report of the robbery and was actively watching for potential suspects--others say he wasn't, and just got his kicks out of harassing a couple of kids for jaywalking while black.  Some say Michael Brown was shot in the front; others say he was shot in from behind.  Some say Brown's hands were up; others say he was simultaneously taunting and perhaps even charging the police officer.  Some say the officer acted professionally; others say that local officers tended to make something of a sport out of trying to provoke their quarries by deliberately taunting or mocking them.

 

If the officer was indeed improperly goading Brown, I think that--regardless of how things played out afterwards--he should be fired and convicted of manslaughter.  But between the little stunt at the convenience store and the reports that Brown had previously "bum-rushed" the cop, it's hard not to conclude that this was a case of a junior-mint thug who was gunning for a Darwin award.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Just_A_Guy

[prisonchaplain]

Every time there is a story of a white person shooting a black person--especially a young, black male, I cringe.  When law enforcement does the shooting I cringe more.  Right, wrong, or indifferent, the majority of black people will see an injustice, and their sense of racist America will be reinforced if the white shooter is exonerated.  Likewise, many (perhaps a majority?) of whites will side with law enforcement.  When these stories get hyped up the truth hardly matters.  Perception is everything.

 

I hate to be a problem presenter, and not a problem solver.  But this is such a huge problem.  Yeah...I hate these kinds of stories.  On a personal level, I "deal" by trying to listen hard, empathize as best I can, and, only when necessary do I engage in any opinion-spouting.

[Blackmarch]

This is really disheartening. An 18 year old man was killed after an altercation with the police, not even an hour after he robs a convenience store. His family is calling for justice, and is protesting, saying that he was an awesome man who wanted to go to college.

 

Thoughts?

I'm leaning towards being more sympathetic with the police in this case.

I think this is overall a symptom of when society dwells on various fear-mongering... It's also why i think mob protesting is almost useless and is one or two steps away from mobocracy. Too many underinformed individuals, and too many who are willing to abuse the situation.

[Miami]

This is really disheartening. An 18 year old man was killed after an altercation with the police, not even an hour after he robs a convenience store. His family is calling for justice, and is protesting, saying that he was an awesome man who wanted to go to college.

Thoughts?

Action have consequences, kids.

[Crypto]

Personally I think the issue that bugs me isn't race, it's the use of force. Police should be better trained to de-escalate rather than command obedience, which can cause issues with already agitated individuals, and When using force avoid shooting in a lethal manner. 

 

What happened in one of the shootings, after watching the youtube video of what happened, is justifiable under law. (I haven't checked the specific states laws though. But at least where I am it is considered justifiable.)

 

The suspect in a threatening manner approaches police, allegedly with a small knife. He was also yelling at them to shoot him.

 

Was it smart to shoot him in that circumstance? Probably not.

 

I support the right of police to their own personal safety. I also think these situations can be improved

Related article to similar circumstance:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/storyline/wp/2014/08/22/first-person-salinas-couldve-been-ferguson-heres-why-it-wasnt/

[jerome1232]

My thoughts?

The officers version of the story has been heavily collaborated. The story told by some is not held up by the autopsy (The claim was that Brown was first hit as he was running away, there were not entry points in the back). The officers injuries and the autopsy collaborates with the officers version. This officer had a spotless record. Brown is already known to be a dishonest and at least somewhat violent person based on the recording of his petty theft.

I still want to see more evidence come out but I think I there's enough to make a decent judgment already, and my judgement comes on the side of the officer who just got his career ruined for not doing anything wrong.

Edited August 26, 2014 by jerome1232

[FlaviusHambonius]

I listened to this several days ago of the black minister Jonathan Gentry voicing out his thought's on the matter.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B092acMImJE

[Palerider]

This situation is about an hour from where I live. The media has already made it's case. Every time they report on it you go away thinking this young man was gunned down by a white police officer. Here in the area where I live we get all the St Louis news channels. They go all day and night about this situation. The day this happened the local news reported that the Mom of this young man said ....he went to bed each night with a smile on his face. They have not said very much about the officers side of the story. I blame the media for most of the rioting that went on. I feel if they had pulled out of Ferguson you may not have seen very much going on at night. Most of the people arrested were not from Ferguson.

The officer pulled up to them and asked them to stop walking in the middle of the street because they were holding up traffic. They responded with no we are not moving. Officer pulled over to get out of vehicle and a fight started between young man and officer.

There is a lot of information that will come out during the trial. The city of Ferguson is not innocent and they could have done some things different.

I could go on and on....but. I won't.

[bytor2112]

Sadly, the race hustlers have managed to get some retribution by stirring up the masses. I read about a guy in Mississippi that was assaulted at a Waffle House parking lot and hospitalized by a large group of black men angry over the incident in Missouri.

 

It doesn't get mentioned often, but the "teenager" was 6'4" tall and weighed 292lbs.....think defensive tackle for a football team. I am only guessing, but getting assaulted by someone that size is very dangerous and could cause one to panic.The police officer doesn't look nearly that large.

Edited August 27, 2014 by bytor2112

[Palerider]

Sadly, the race hustlers have managed to get some retribution by stirring up the masses. I read about a guy in Mississippi that was assaulted at a Waffle House parking lot and hospitalized by a large group of black men angry over the incident in Missouri.

 

It doesn't get mentioned often, but the "teenager" was 6'4" tall and weighed 292lbs.....think defensive tackle for a football team. I am only guessing, but getting assaulted by someone that size is very dangerous and could cause one to panic.The police officer doesn't look nearly that large.

There are pictures of officer that have not been released yet to the public. His face is beat up from the struggle inside his vehicle and as they struggled for his weapon.

[MarginOfError]

I spoke to a friend last night who lived in St Louis most of his life before moving here.  His only commentary were that race relations in Ferguson (and that area around St Louis) are a mess, and have been for years.  He also stated that police officers in that area had a reputation for being a bit militant and aggressive and that they have a very strong "us vs. them" mentality.  To put that in context, in 2000 (or thereabouts), Ferguson had more murders per capita than any other city in the country.  

 

The feeling I get from the whole situation is that for some reason, this one incident was the one that caused the pot to boil over.  It may not be a very good example of the issues at play, but there are some deep and serious issue at play in the area.  And there's a lot of blame to be passed around for that. 

 

In this particular instance, I'm willing to let the investigation take it's place and let the facts speak for themselves.  But the circumstances of this particular case don't exonerate the police and citizens in the area from the problems that led to this over-boil.

[bytor2112]

Interesting if true.....

[Palerider]

Actually it was the city of St Louis that was and probably still is the leader in homicides per capita. Ferguson is in St Louis County just outside the city limits. The Northern part of the City is the worse part. They have tried different things to get the numbers down and nothing has really helped

[writesong]

Brethren and Sistren:

 

Here is the URL where you can listen to the SAINT LOUIS COUNTY POLICE RADIO SCANNER:

 

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/st-louis-county-police-scanner

 

Thank you.

[pam]

It's being shown all over the news.

[writesong]

Brethren and Sistren:

 

You can use your computer to monitor calls on the TROOP "C", MISSOURI STATE HIGHWAY PATROL SCANNER:

 

http://www.broadcastify.com/listen/feed/17925/web

 

Thank you.

[Palerider]

It ain't pretty

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

Palerider,  

 

Even though I am deeply saddened by the non-indictment, I don't condone violence.  (My heroes are pacifists like Ghandi and Martin Luther King Jr.).  I remember that you live in the area and I hope you and your family will be safe. 

 

Praying that everyone will be safe and wise in the coming days.

 

Leslie

[Windseeker]

Anyone get the connection with corporate America and Ferguson?

Ferguson Michael Brown Shooting: 'Boycott Black Friday' Aims to Hit America Where it Hurts

More logic from the Left or am I missing something here?

 

If you can't loot it, boycott it?

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

I don't understand why you keep assuming that "the Left" has something to do with this...as if it is some political conspiracy.

 

I understand the connection just fine, but it has nothing to do with Democrats or Republicans.

[jerome1232]

The heck!? Am I missing something? This was a standard jury that decided this right? 12 regular ladies and gents got to see a bunch of evidence and all reached the same conclusion but somehow justice was egregiously robbed?

I.Just.Don't.Get.It

[Just_A_Guy]

Grand juries don't have to be unanimous, FWIW--just need a 3/4 majority.

[Dravin]

Personally I think the issue that bugs me isn't race, it's the use of force. Police should be better trained to de-escalate rather than command obedience, which can cause issues with already agitated individuals, and When using force avoid shooting in a lethal manner. 

 

 

 

Do you mean avoid using lethal force when force is called for? If a cop isn't justified in using lethal force he shouldn't be pulling the trigger. Ideally all shootings are in a lethal manner and no shootings are in a non-lethal manner. Indeed 'shooting to wound'* can be prima facie evidence that you didn't feel lethal force was justified, in which case you used the wrong tool for the job.

 

*If you meant something else by 'avoid shooting in a lethal manner' I'd welcome clarification.

Edited November 25, 2014 by Dravin

[pam]

I don't understand why you keep assuming that "the Left" has something to do with this...as if it is some political conspiracy.

 

I understand the connection just fine, but it has nothing to do with Democrats or Republicans.

 

A friend of mine posted on his facebook page that it was interesting that the Prosecutor was a Democrat.  I'm thinking what?  Really?  What does this have to do with this?  This was decided by a grand jury that went through every single bit of evidence and made their decision based on the evidence.  It had nothing to do with the Prosecutor being a Democrat.  Really people.