Am I the only aware member with alarm bells going off in his head?

[Guest MormonGator]

Just now, mirkwood said:

Careful there.  Your profile picture might change.

Play nice children. Don't make me get the moderators. @Just_A_Guy, how can you allow this?!! 

[mirkwood]

Have you ever noticed that every thread @MormonGator gets involved in becomes derailed?

[Guest MormonGator]

Just now, mirkwood said:

Have you ever noticed that every thread @MormonGator gets involved in becomes derailed?

You are just jealous of my wit and erudition. 

[Guest]

On 11/18/2017 at 12:17 AM, pam said:

Thank you.  Because I was immediately put off by the "credentials."

I was personally wondering why he considered those to be valuable "credentials."

[Guest]

55 minutes ago, mirkwood said:

Have you ever noticed that every thread @MormonGator gets involved in becomes derailed?

WHAT!?!??  He's taking over my prized role on this forum?  How dare he!

@MormonGator, I'm going to forbid you from derailing any further posts until I have more time to post sufficiently to catch up.  Remember, I'm the king of threadjacks here. 

Cue Morty:  Dond joo for-ged dat!!!

Edited November 21, 2017 by Guest

[Guest MormonGator]

Just now, Carborendum said:

WHAT!?!??  He's taking over my prized role on this forum?  How dare he!

@MormonGator, I'm going to forbid you from derailing any further posts until I have more time to post sufficiently to catch up.  Remember, I'm the king of threadjacks here. 

Cue Morty:  Dond joo forged dat!!!

I learned from the master! 

[askandanswer]

9 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

I learned from the master! 

lol, there you go again, pretending you can learn. Looks like @mirkwood is not the only one being dishonest on this thread,

[Guest MormonGator]

2 minutes ago, askandanswer said:

lol, there you go again, pretending you can learn. Looks like @mirkwood is not the only one being dishonest on this thread,

I'm just glad you can express yourself polysyllabically. We've been working on that for awhile. Good job @askandanswer

[askandanswer]

askandanswer has just as many syllables as @MormonGator

[Guest MormonGator]

1 minute ago, askandanswer said:

askandanswer has just as many syllables as @MormonGator

Exactly! Aren't you glad I picked that name for you? Now you can be like me in another way! 

Edited November 21, 2017 by MormonGator

[pam]

44 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Exactly! Aren't you glad I picked that name for you? Now you can be like me in another way! 

I'm scared now.

[Alex]

A step closer.

Yes, it's just analysis but good journalism is about putting pieces together- for example, recall a Time magazine article back about a year before Russia invaded Afghanistan that predicted the soviet invasion. Hmm, and on the topic of good journalism, there were plenty of articles across European newspapers that noted the rise of nazism in Germany before WW2- 90,000 Jews escaped Germany and Austria prior to the holocaust.

Anyway, the rise of the A/C is not going to be a glaring and obvious ascension to power. It will be methodically deceitful and many will see good before the nightmare begins

http://mondoweiss.net/2017/12/dangerous-netanyahu-planning/

 

 

[Alex]

Trump is about to recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. First time a US president has done so and the forecast is for immediate violence across Israel and the palestinian territories.

The news hit the wires an hour ago.

I can't see the future but I can see some scenarios playing out here that involve Saudi getting involved to remove Iranian backed Hezbollah. Violence on the streets is a convincing prelude to foreign intervention and the conservative right, around the entire globe, will love a muslim prince of Saudi who 'fights for Israel'.

The Saudi prince was just named Time Magazine's Person of the Year btw.

[mordorbund]

13 hours ago, Alex said:

The Saudi prince was just named Time Magazine's Person of the Year btw.

Was he propositioned by Harvey Weinstein?

http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/06/media/time-person-of-the-year-2017/index.html

[Alex]

1 hour ago, mordorbund said:

Was he propositioned by Harvey Weinstein?

http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/06/media/time-person-of-the-year-2017/index.html

Yes, I should clarify that bin salman won the Time Magazine Person of the Year readers poll, which is, I think, worse than the choice of the editors. So many people think he's wonderful.

http://time.com/5021948/person-of-the-year-reader-poll-2017/

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Alex said:

So many people think he's wonderful.

Non-snarky question:  What makes you think he's not?

I recognize that everything I get is about third or fourth hand at best about him.  Some good, some bad.  I don't know what to make of it.  All I can see is what he's actually done.  And all I can tell is that if his motives are good, then he's probably doing something good.  If otherwise, then he's probably doing something bad.  Do you have some insights that I don't?

[Alex]

2 hours ago, Carborendum said:

Non-snarky question:  What makes you think he's not?

I recognize that everything I get is about third or fourth hand at best about him.  Some good, some bad.  I don't know what to make of it.  All I can see is what he's actually done.  And all I can tell is that if his motives are good, then he's probably doing something good.  If otherwise, then he's probably doing something bad.  Do you have some insights that I don't?

Hmm, so far the torture of captives is the big give away to the real mbs. The tricky thing is that he's using American mercenaries to do the torturing though- many will cite that is all perfectly okay because in war 'you have to torture' your enemies. 'They can't be bad people if they are former American troops', after all.

The rise of the a/c will be praised by many men. His ascension to popular praise is shrouded in deceit.

If we think about the last time there was a peace-bringer to a nation racked with Islamic/Arabic hatreds, that would be Sadat, who was assassinated by his own people. Sadat's peace was the same sort of peace that the Hashemite king of Jordan was faced with- a realization that Israel couldn't be beaten with war.

See, what mbs is ushering in runs so counter-clockwise to Arab hatred of the Jews that it doesn't make sense- it only makes economic sense and I don't believe that is enough to discard the generational hatreds he was raised in. There has never been a wake up call that fighting Israel is unwinnable for Saudi has never gone to war with Israel but there has been a generational hatred/mistrust of Jews in Saudi.

 

1) The first task of making people believe in his path is nearly complete. There will be more public displays of him bringing 'peace' and more people fawning over him before the second phase begins. 

2) The second phase is that he will be nearly killed in an attack- and I'm betting that the attack will be carried out by radical muslims as that would further cement his 'courageous man of peace' persona in the West.

3) After that he gains an accomplice who preaches of his miracles. Plenty in the West will believe his miracles because after all, 'he brought about peace'.

 

If we go back a few months, that meeting he had with shiite muqtada al-sadr was sooo odd because the arabs are calling bin salman the 'leader of the sunni world' now. I can't prove it but with al-sadr's maniacal hatred of Israel for being the infadel government that controls the al-aqsa mosque in Jerusalem, I'm betting bin salman let it be known that he was intending to eventually control the mosque in Jerusalem. Why else would a willing shiite martyr for shia suddenly befriend a sunni rival- you can't tell me it was for peace because muqtada is every bit as bloodthirsty as the Syrian leader is? No, the peace between mbs and muqtada doesn't add up- it has that stench of conniving to it.

 

But for now though, well, all he needs you to do is marvel at his great achievements in opposing radicalism. The more 'peace' he brings about now, the easier it will be to praise him later when he offers the starving food.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Alex said:

Hmm, so far the torture of captives is the big give away to the real mbs.

Really, who's doing the reporting of said torture?

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/exclusive-senior-figures-tortured-and-beaten-saudi-purge-1489501498

The thing about news sources that you've never heard about before... You don't know if you can trust them.

David Hearst (the editor-in-chief) was a foreign correspondent/writer for the Guardian who spent an awful lot of time praising the Muslim Brotherhood as the best hope for democracy in the Middle East and decrying any government that stood in their way.  That's a laugh.  Boy! I sure trust that guy and his insight into the dynamics of the Middle East.

Even if you do, don't you find it funny that they never give any details of what "torture" they went through.  In fact, the specifically say they are unable to provide details.  So, how exactly did they find out about it?  They just heard someone tell them that torture was used during the arrests?  Gee that sounds convincing.

How about Foreign Affairs Magazine?

Quote

MbS’ early moves include cutting various subsidies, raising taxes, selling major state assets, pushing for a culture of efficiency and accountability in the notoriously unproductive Saudi bureaucracy, and making room for the private sector to play a larger role in the economy.

Sounds good.

Quote

MbS has total control over the country’s oil monopoly, the national investment fund, economic affairs, and the humongous Ministry of Defense. 

Sounds bad.  

So, a little bit of both?  In other words, just your average Middle Eastern Royalty vying for power?  So, what's for dinner?

1 hour ago, Alex said:

The rise of the a/c will be praised by many men. His ascension to popular praise is shrouded in deceit.

Where do you see this praise you speak of?  All I hear is people saying he's consolidated power at a young age.  It raises an eyebrow to be suspicious.  I'd hardly call that praise.

1 hour ago, Alex said:

If we think about the last time there was a peace-bringer to a nation racked with Islamic/Arabic hatreds, that would be Sadat, who was assassinated by his own people. Sadat's peace was the same sort of peace that the Hashemite king of Jordan was faced with- a realization that Israel couldn't be beaten with war.

I don't understand.  You're condemning him because he's got a pro-Israel position?  Maybe you're not saying that.  You're drawing parallels that aren't parallel.  What are you trying to say?

1 hour ago, Alex said:

1) The first task of making people believe in his path is nearly complete. There will be more public displays of him bringing 'peace' and more people fawning over him before the second phase begins. 

2) The second phase is that he will be nearly killed in an attack- and I'm betting that the attack will be carried out by radical muslims as that would further cement his 'courageous man of peace' persona in the West.

3) After that he gains an accomplice who preaches of his miracles. Plenty in the West will believe his miracles because after all, 'he brought about peace'.

OK, you can't actually say what he's done that is like the A/C, so you're going to make predictions about what he is going to do.  Ok.  Have a field day.  We'll see what happens.  If you're right, you're right.  If you're wrong, will you snap out of this thing?

1 hour ago, Alex said:

If we go back a few months, that meeting he had with shiite muqtada al-sadr was sooo odd because the arabs are calling bin salman the 'leader of the sunni world' now. I can't prove it but with al-sadr's maniacal hatred of Israel for being the infadel government that controls the al-aqsa mosque in Jerusalem, I'm betting bin salman let it be known that he was intending to eventually control the mosque in Jerusalem. Why else would a willing shiite martyr for shia suddenly befriend a sunni rival- you can't tell me it was for peace because muqtada is every bit as bloodthirsty as the Syrian leader is? No, the peace between mbs and muqtada doesn't add up- it has that stench of conniving to it.

They are both interested in obtaining and keeping power for their own governments in their own nations so they can keep running the show.  There is nothing saintly nor fiendish about that.  It is what everyone in power does.  I'd hardly call this either praiseworthy or despicable.

They have decided to have an uneasy alliance against the Muslim Brotherhood.  SMaS would love to see those guys go away.  And MbS would want to keep them from obtaining power over any more nations -- especially his own.  This has little to do with Israel or America or their hatred of each other.

1 hour ago, Alex said:

But for now though, well, all he needs you to do is marvel at his great achievements in opposing radicalism. The more 'peace' he brings about now, the easier it will be to praise him later when he offers the starving food.

What great achievements?  I'm not marveling at anything.  I don't see him doing anything impressive.  Again, who's doing the praising you're talking about?  The Guardian?  The M.E.E.?

I'd hardly call either of those publications as dominating world thought.

At least you tried.  But accusations and suspicion alone do not provide anything that we should make judgments off of.  But you're young and impressionable.  So, I guess it is to be expected.

Edited December 7, 2017 by Guest

[Alex]

1 minute ago, Carborendum said:

Really, who's doing the reporting of said torture?

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/exclusive-senior-figures-tortured-and-beaten-saudi-purge-1489501498

The thing about news sources that you've never heard about before... You don't know if you can trust them.

David Hearst (the editor-in-chief) was a foreign correspondent/writer for the Guardian who spent an awful lot of time praising the Muslim Brotherhood as the best hope for democracy in the Middle East and decrying any government that stood in their way.  That's a laugh.  Boy! I sure trust that guy and his insight into the dynamics of the Middle East.

How about Foreign Affairs Magazine?

Sounds good.

Sounds bad.  

So, a little bit of both?  In other words, just your average Middle Eastern Royalty vying for power?  So, what's for dinner?

Where do you see this praise you speak of?  All I hear is people saying he's consolidated power at a young age.  It raises an eyebrow to be suspicious.  I'd hardly call that praise.

I don't understand.  You're condemning him because he's got a pro-Israel position?  Maybe you're not saying that.  You're drawing parallels that aren't parallel.  What are you trying to say?

OK, you can't actually say what he's done that is like the A/C, so you're going to make predictions about what he is going to do.  Ok.  Have a field day.  We'll see what happens.  If you're right, you're right.  If you're wrong, will you snap out of this thing?

They are both interested in obtaining and keeping power for their own governments in their own nations so they can keep running the show.  There is nothing saintly nor fiendish about that.  It is what everyone in power does.  I'd hardly call this either praiseworthy or despicable.

They have decided to have an uneasy alliance against the Muslim Brotherhood.  SMaS would love to see those guys go away.  And MbS would want to keep them from obtaining power over any more nations -- especially his own.  This has little to do with Israel or America or their hatred of each other.

What great achievements?  I'm not marveling at anything.  I don't see him doing anything impressive.  Again, who's doing the praising you're talking about?  The Guardian?  The M.E.E.?

I'd hardly call either of those publications as dominating world thought.

At least you tried.  But accusations and suspicion alone do not provide anything that we should make judgments off of.  But you're young and impressionable.  So, I guess it is to be expected.

Back in 2016 his links to Al Qaeda were not imagined...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/prince-mohammed-bin-salman-naive-arrogant-saudi-prince-is-playing-with-fire-a6804481.html

But now we have Trump in charge with his hotel interests in Saudi, all is overlooked? An alliance and war with Israel to rid Lebanon/Pal territories of Hezbollah, should it happen, is not built upon anything like unto a solid foundation. 

It isn't me seeing him as wonderful, or trying to defend him. It's some of the children of Israel:

http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Secret-ties-A-guide-to-Saudi-Crown-Prince-Mohammad-bin-Salman-514904

along with the Pakistani's etc

http://www.arabnews.com/node/1200576/saudi-arabia

 

Anyway, the next few weeks following Trump's announcement, along with the USA moving its embassy to Jerusalem, will see events unfold. Maybe a new intifada?

 

Whatever the reaction, mbs will be there to fight those evil radical forces funded by Iran...

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Alex said:

Back in 2016 his links to Al Qaeda were not imagined...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/prince-mohammed-bin-salman-naive-arrogant-saudi-prince-is-playing-with-fire-a6804481.html

Uhmm... I don't see any mention of his ties with Al Qaeda in this article.  Could you point it out?

2 minutes ago, Alex said:

But now we have Trump in charge with his hotel interests in Saudi, all is overlooked? An alliance and war with Israel to rid Lebanon/Pal territories of Hezbollah, should it happen, is not built upon anything like unto a solid foundation. 

How is this overlooked?  You yourself have already pointed to multiple places where people are looking very suspiciously at MbS for the past several years.  And mainstream media has also reported on the arrests.  But the media is so busy lately trying to pounce on Moore to deflect attention from the multiple Democrats who've actually done things that they can't spend any time on things that really matter.

2 minutes ago, Alex said:

It isn't me seeing him as wonderful, or trying to defend him. It's some of the children of Israel:

http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Secret-ties-A-guide-to-Saudi-Crown-Prince-Mohammad-bin-Salman-514904

I don't see them defending him.  They say his actions are reckless.

2 minutes ago, Alex said:

along with the Pakistani's etc

http://www.arabnews.com/node/1200576/saudi-arabia

That actually sounds perfectly reasonable... if you're a Pakistani.

2 minutes ago, Alex said:

Anyway, the next few weeks following Trump's announcement, along with the USA moving its embassy to Jerusalem, will see events unfold. Maybe a new intifada?

Whatever the reaction, mbs will be there to fight those evil radical forces funded by Iran...

Again future events.  As I've continued to say... We'll see. 

[Alex]

6 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Uhmm... I don't see any mention of his ties with Al Qaeda in this article.  Could you point it out?

Here:

"The BND lists the areas in which Saudi Arabia is adopting a more aggressive and warlike policy. In Syria, in early 2015, it supported the creation of The Army of Conquest, primarily made up of the al-Qaeda affiliate the al-Nusra Front and the ideologically similar Ahrar al-Sham, which won a series of victories against the Syrian Army in Idlib province. In Yemen, it began an air war directed against the Houthi movement and the Yemeni army, which shows no sign of ending. Among those who gain are al-Qaeda in the Arabian peninsula, which the US has been fruitlessly trying to weaken for years by drone strikes. "

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Alex said:

Here:

"The BND lists the areas in which Saudi Arabia is adopting a more aggressive and warlike policy. In Syria, in early 2015, it supported the creation of The Army of Conquest, primarily made up of the al-Qaeda affiliate the al-Nusra Front and the ideologically similar Ahrar al-Sham, which won a series of victories against the Syrian Army in Idlib province. In Yemen, it began an air war directed against the Houthi movement and the Yemeni army, which shows no sign of ending. Among those who gain are al-Qaeda in the Arabian peninsula, which the US has been fruitlessly trying to weaken for years by drone strikes. "

Thank you.

[Alex]

7 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

I don't see them defending him.  They say his actions are reckless.

“Lots of Israelis see Mohammad bin Salman’s assertiveness favorably and as a positive thing. But I think this conduct is reckless."

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Alex said:

“Lots of Israelis see Mohammad bin Salman’s assertiveness favorably and as a positive thing. But I think this conduct is reckless."

Exactly.  What?  You can't find a good quality in someone you're asked to share an opinion about without him being the A/C?  This was a sideways compliment.  Hardly praise.  And it is nowhere near the worship that would accompany the A/C.

Edited December 7, 2017 by Guest

[Alex]

4 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Exactly.  What?  You can't find a good quality in someone you're asked to share an opinion about without him being the A/C?  This was a sideways compliment.  Hardly praise.  And it is nowhere near the worship that would accompany the A/C.

The bigger picture must be taken into account. The Israelis were benefiting from the war in Syria over the last 4 years because Syria was preoccupied with winning the war on its own soil rather than with funding Hezbollah.

I think that whole 'let's let them fight each other instead of us' mentality might be gaining popularity among the Israelis. It's the perfect storm for the rise of a deceiver now.