Lee

Do you bother dressing modestly at home?

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So I don’t post much because of the crazy hours I work. I’m a social worker and I spend my days going in and out of peoples’ homes. In doing this trust me athletic type clothing I would consider modest compared to how some dress when they open the door to me, and they know I’m scheduled to be there.

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4 hours ago, Vort said:

A husband always has the right to question his wife's dress choices. Whether exercising that right is a wise idea is a completely different question, often with the opposite answer.

 From Lee's description, it sounds like his wife was not nude or seminude, or prancing around the house in her underwear or a bikini. So if she feels good about wearing such clothing casually (i.e. apparently not wearing the temple garment), then I'm not quite sure how company coming over changes that equation.

My wife and I always question what we are wearing, if my wife doesn't like my clothes she will throw a new shirt at me and I will change.  When my wife's friends come over I always make an effort to wear something nice  I was asking her to do the same. 

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15 hours ago, Bini said:

Of course, our bodies are not the same. But men are held accountable just as much as women are, yes? Someone, please explain to me why the female body is sexualised and the male body is not.

Around 6 years ago I played pro soccer and I knew the ladies loved my body because I was seriously ripped. Whenever I scored I would always jog over to the stand between the dugout and the cheerleaders and take my top off to celebrate. It was awesome I would see women look at me seductively, I would hear cheers one time I even let a female fan touch my chest. In nightclubs I would always lift my shirt up. Women used to sexualise my body all the time they probably still do. My wife sexualises other men sometimes if we are watching a movie with Channing Tatum I have to listen to my wife's appreciation of his body I just think it is funny. Whereas if I do that with a woman on TV my wife gives me the look of death. 

The point is I don't want other men sexualising my wife because that isn't treating her with respect, it isn't my wife's fault if they do that no matter what she is wearing but because she knows I don't like it I expect her to cover up to prevent it.  

Edited by Lee
Spelling mistake

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Wait... what?  A husband has no right to tell his wife what to wear???  Crazy talk!

When your wife asks you if she looks good in what she's wearing... TELL HER THE TRUTH.  You're the ONLY ONE who is her confidante, her protector, the one that can stop her from making a fool of herself.

If you are not comfortable with telling your wife... "Dear, that dress doesn't really look good on you.  This one does."... something is wrong with your marriage.

And that's all I'm gonna say about that.

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And to answer the OP.

When somebody other than my husband and children visit us, I wear clothing appropriate for the public.  It's a show of respect for my guests.  If they decide to live in my house for a few days, then I dress according to how I always dress at home, except we refrain from running around the house in our underwear or naked in areas accessible to our guest.  So, that's why I bought a house with ensuite bathrooms.

I don't live my life solely for my comfort.  I live my life 24/7 with an eye to serving others - especially my husband.  I try to present myself - including my hair - according to what pleases my husband.  He absolutely deserves to spend everyday of his life surrounded by what pleases him - because he has set his life such that, for the most part, what pleases him pleases God.  Therefore, I absolutely welcome his correction on the appropriateness of what I'm wearing as it is also a reflection of him and the Priesthood that he holds.

And that is what you call Love and Marriage in a horse's carriage ready for @SilentOne to make into a podcast.

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37 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

When your wife asks you if she looks good in what she's wearing... TELL HER THE TRUTH.

Unless, of course, the truth is "Stop trying to blame that on the dress.  The presence of any useful amount of ambient light is what makes your butt look big."

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8 minutes ago, NightSG said:

Unless, of course, the truth is "Stop trying to blame that on the dress.  The presence of any useful amount of ambient light is what makes your butt look big."

Even that truth needs to be said.  But, of course, diplomacy requires kindness.  "Your butt is big but I still like it because it's part of you (ooooh... romantic criticisms are the best!)."  is a better choice.  And of course, there's also the rule that must be followed:  Do not speak unless you can improve the silence.

Edited by anatess2

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1 hour ago, anatess2 said:

Wait... what?  A husband has no right to tell his wife what to wear???  Crazy talk!

When your wife asks you if she looks good in what she's wearing... TELL HER THE TRUTH.  You're the ONLY ONE who is her confidante, her protector, the one that can stop her from making a fool of herself.

If you are not comfortable with telling your wife... "Dear, that dress doesn't really look good on you.  This one does."... something is wrong with your marriage.

And that's all I'm gonna say about that.

My wife is always telling me to shave and she tells me to change my outfit a lot. Most of the time she picks my outfit for me, my wife knows there are 2 things I hate her wearing and she doesn't wear those but otherwise she always looks good to me. 

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7 hours ago, Lee said:

My wife is always telling me to shave and she tells me to change my outfit a lot. Most of the time she picks my outfit for me, my wife knows there are 2 things I hate her wearing and she doesn't wear those but otherwise she always looks good to me. 

My husband doesn't like my Georgiou flower pants so I don't wear it.  My husband loves the "spice girl" pants he got me for my bday but I don't like it so I returned it to the mall.

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I always turn to the scriptures on any topic in question (and conference talks!) 

the topic of nakedness in the Old Testament is synonymous with shame and fornication.

Modesty is always the best policy, even at home, even when alone. 

The spirit can attend when strict obedience is adhered to. 

But of course we all have our free agency and yes I have skimpy clothes in my closet that need to be thrown out....

 

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Modesty is a form of Courtesy.

All civilizations adopt social rules of courtesy, ethics, morals etc... Some of which may be different from one another (Such as cultures where partial nudity is not sexualized). This forms a baseline of expectations for people to interact with each other. It's purpose is simple, to create an environment where they and others can get along, and feel safe with each other (arguably the first safe space...). Courtesy communicates non-aggression or aggression and other such information (You bet you can make a long list!). Regardless of agreement or disagreement with what others view is appropriate courtesy, if you wish to coexist and communicate with others effectively it is important to understand what others think when it comes to courtesy. In this context Modesty has more to do with getting along with others. 

Suggesting modesty doesn't always mean that you are objectifying another person, or victim shaming them. 

 

Edited by Crypto

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Guest
On 5/26/2018 at 4:56 PM, Bini said:

I disagree. If I am comfortable with my body and feel comfortable in what I am wearing inside my own home, I am not going to change that for the sake of a guest, they can accept me as I am or we can schedule a meet up at another time. I think there is quite a difference between lounging around in your underwear or garments versus being shirtless or wearing a sleeveless tank top and shorts. 

You are not LDS.  You don't have the same modesty standards.  Different story.

On 5/26/2018 at 5:11 PM, Bini said:

What is modesty? What is the intent for that? To stop "unclean" thoughts that might lead to "sinful" actions. These are things that are the responsibility of, in this case, the friend who is coming over to visit. (Although it applies to everyone. We are responsible for our own thoughts and actions.) It is not everyone else's responsibility to stop me from having wandering eyes, thoughts, or committing certain actions. That is on me.

Modesty is about us treating our bodies as temples.  We don't share the temple with anyone.  There are standards of entry.  Only those who have temple recommends are even allowed inside.

Analogously, treating our bodies as temples means having certain standards of dress.  For Mormons, there are some standards that are outlined.  For a non-Mormon, there are different standards (or NO standards as is sometimes the case).  

Our "dress standard" is part of being a Mormon.  It is part of being a peculiar people.  It is part of letting our light shine.  That has almost nothing to do with "being responsible for someone else's thoughts."  It is about what WE do with OUR choices, OUR light, OUR demeanor, how WE choose to present ourselves.

Edited by Guest

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On 5/27/2018 at 1:21 AM, Vort said:

Surely you see that in general, within our society, men are much more susceptible to sexual desires than women.

I'm going to be a bit pedantic and suggest that a more correct way to put this would be, that (in general) men are more aroused by visual cues than women are. Being "susceptible to sexual desires" doesn't make much sense. Both men and women desire sex, but (again, in general) become aroused differently.

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On 5/26/2018 at 11:59 PM, Grunt said:

I'm sure it's up to the individual, but standards of modesty exist when we interact with each other, regardless of where we are.

 

On 5/27/2018 at 12:06 AM, Bini said:

Women are not responsible for the thoughts men have about their bodies. Their thoughts are their responsibility. Our bodies are not objects and therefore should not be treated as distractions. I disagree that OP's wife should have to change clothes for the sake of a man entering her domain -- her home -- her safe environment. Maybe OP should suggest to his friend that he either closes his eyes or doesn't sexualise his wife while he visits.

I'm going to point out some problems with the logic here. @Grunt said: "Standards of modesty exist when we interact with each other." All of a sudden, in the next post, suddenly women aren't responsible for the thoughts men have? I think that someone has jumped to a few conclusions here.

Western society has, historically anyway, some conventions regarding what Mormons usually call modesty, but can also be called propriety, decorum, dignity, etc. It's a social convention, yes. Other societies don't have quite the same rules, e.g. those originating from tropical regions. If you want to get along with someone, then you need to follow the rules that they consider to be important. This is a two-way thing, one group can't just demand concessions from the other, there needs to be some compromise. In this instance, the guest may not have been comfortable around the lady of the lady of the house dressed as described. If she wants him there, then as much as he needs to respect her rules, she also needs to accommodate him. If she doesn't want him there, then she and her husband need to have a discussion around when guests are and are not appropriate, which ones are ok or not ok, etc.

As to what is appropriate and what is not, I venture no opinion. If we want to associate with each other, then we need to agree on these kinds of things. The issue here is *not* "If [guest] looks at [hostess]'s lady parts and thinks naughty thoughts, it's his problem not hers."

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On 5/26/2018 at 4:06 PM, Bini said:

Women are not responsible for the thoughts men have about their bodies. Their thoughts are their responsibility.  home -- her safe environment.

BUT. Modesty is council from the Lord based on how He wants us to treat or bodies and he said cover up. That's the reason. Not people's thoughts. Respect.

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