Urgent responses requested re meeting with confused investigator

[askandanswer]

Hi all

A short time ago an investigator probably in his early 20s who has been coming to church for the last several weeks asked if he could meet with me tonight. He said he is confused and thinks he is gay. He is unsure how people at church might react to him being gay. He said he is generally a fairly anxious person and this is making him more anxious. He feels he has many choices pulling him in different directions and this is causing him a lot of stress. He is not sure what to do and does not like the feeling of being in this in-between sort of place being unsure where to go or what to do. I think but I'm not sure that concern about the possibility of being gay and how people might react to that is at the top of his list but is far from the only thing on his list. 

What do you think i should read to prepare to counsel with him and what do you think are the main messages i should try to convey?

[CV75]

4 minutes ago, askandanswer said:

Hi all

A short time ago an investigator probably in his early 20s who has been coming to church for the last several weeks asked if he could meet with me tonight. He said he is confused and thinks he is gay. He is unsure how people at church might react to him being gay. He said he is generally a fairly anxious person and this is making him more anxious. He feels he has many choices pulling him in different directions and this is causing him a lot of stress. He is not sure what to do and does not like the feeling of being in this in-between sort of place being unsure where to go or what to do. I think but I'm not sure that concern about the possibility of being gay and how people might react to that is at the top of his list but is far from the only thing on his list. 

What do you think i should read to prepare to counsel with him and what do you think are the main messages i should try to convey?

Review the priesthood manual on giving blessings.

[zil2]

The Gospel Topic entry on Same-Sex Attraction may help.  I like @CV75's answer though - a blessing of peace or guidance may be what this man needs first.  And remember to keep Christ at the center of everything - Christ is the one who can help you and him.

[askandanswer]

Now that I'm home from church and have had a few minutes to think about it, at the moment the thought comes to me that I should try to teach him how to pray and how to receive and recognise answers to prayers. I probably can't tell him all he needs to know so I should focus on helping him understand how he can find out for himself and building his faith that he can do so. This obviously doesn't in any way lessen my need to do all I can to prepare for tonight. 

[laronius]

38 minutes ago, askandanswer said:

Now that I'm home from church and have had a few minutes to think about it, at the moment the thought comes to me that I should try to teach him how to pray and how to receive and recognise answers to prayers. I probably can't tell him all he needs to know so I should focus on helping him understand how he can find out for himself and building his faith that he can do so. This obviously doesn't in any way lessen my need to do all I can to prepare for tonight. 

I like your thoughts. To me the answer to his problem hasn't changed. Gaining a testimony is still what matters most. He needs to understand who God is, who he is in relation to God and how God will communicate to him (both personally and through righteous church leaders).

I would also assure him that he doesn't have to make any final decisions about anything right this minute. Satan wants to pressure him to feel like he has to choose now in response to fear but that is not necessary. If he has not yet started praying this would be a good time for him to begin praying for peace while he figures things out. An answer to that prayer can be a blessing to him in more ways than one.

Your opening comments made me think of Lehi and Nephi's vision of the tree of life and the mists of darkness. That may be something good to ponder on. Might be good for him to ponder on as well.

Good luck!!!!

[askandanswer]

The meeting went well. We sat on the small cliffs above the beach, watching the sun slip into the ocean. He's a lot gayer than I thought - he's been living with a male partner for most of the year, and although he says they love each other very much, the relationship is deteriorating, with both of them seeming to want different things. He very much wants to have his own family. He is the only child from a Chinese family and his parents have disowned him because he is gay. He is aware of the church's online resources about same-sex attraction. He thought, but wasn't sure that he couldn't marry a same sex partner and be a member of the church and I confirmed that he would have to choose one or the other. He was devastated by that, really shook up, but it didn't end his interest. He is leaning more towards the church than towards having his own family. He thinks that would involve giving up so much that he wants, but he is more motivated to fill the yearning, searching, empty hole in his heart that has been so much a part of his life for as long as he can remember. There are also some mental health issues that are much better than they were a year ago but still not completely resolved. 

We agreed that the first thing he needs to do is to start work on developing a relationship with God. He has agreed to set aside an unspecified amount of time each day devoted to that purpose. 

[zil2]

2 hours ago, askandanswer said:

He thinks that would involve giving up so much that he wants, but he is more motivated to fill the yearning, searching, empty hole in his heart that has been so much a part of his life for as long as he can remember.

I hope I'm not the only person here praying for this young man, whoever he is.

If he's willing, @askandanswer, perhaps some family history work (I know, right now he can only do research and make connections) would help to get him assistance from the other side of the veil, too.

[mikbone]

Man… These are so hard.  And not my area of expertise.

Mental health, confusion, for all you know the young man could be attracted to you.  If you swoop in and solve his problems he may appreciate you as a mentor which could also be awkward emotionally.

My biggest concern is that he came to you with a presentation that he thought he might be gay.  He is straight-up Gay.  

This subterfuge or loose appreciation for truth and integrity is a red flag.  I’d refer him to the Bishop or (sister?) Missionaries so fast.

[CV75]

14 hours ago, askandanswer said:

Hi all

A short time ago an investigator probably in his early 20s who has been coming to church for the last several weeks asked if he could meet with me tonight. He said he is confused and thinks he is gay. He is unsure how people at church might react to him being gay. He said he is generally a fairly anxious person and this is making him more anxious. He feels he has many choices pulling him in different directions and this is causing him a lot of stress. He is not sure what to do and does not like the feeling of being in this in-between sort of place being unsure where to go or what to do. I think but I'm not sure that concern about the possibility of being gay and how people might react to that is at the top of his list but is far from the only thing on his list. 

What do you think i should read to prepare to counsel with him and what do you think are the main messages i should try to convey?

So how did it go?

[Carborendum]

15 hours ago, askandanswer said:

What do you think i should read to prepare to counsel with him and what do you think are the main messages i should try to convey?

I'd really consider these words.

1 hour ago, mikbone said:

Mental health, confusion, for all you know the young man could be attracted to you.  If you swoop in and solve his problems he may appreciate you as a mentor which could also be awkward emotionally.

My biggest concern is that he came to you with a presentation that he thought he might be gay.  He is straight-up Gay.  

This subterfuge or loose appreciation for truth and integrity is a red flag.  I’d refer him to the Bishop or (sister?) Missionaries so fast.

Be careful.

[NeuroTypical]

I'm a fan of talking about the massive bumpy road before you're actually on it and can't ignore it any more.   

"Mormons have always been huge on the traditional family unit, consisting of a husband, a wife, both of them opposite sex, working together to raise the children.   Although we're big on agency and choice, and acknowledge people sometimes want other things, if you become a Mormon you can expect to be taught what we consider the ideal model.  Folks who don't follow that model are welcome.  We believe everyone is a child of God, and we are big on loving our neighbor.  But we won't be changing our doctrine any time soon to fit the current culture.  Let's read the Proclamation on the Family - that might help answer your questions."

 

"But NT, that'll make 'em run for the hills before they even bother to seek a testimony!  Isn't it better to downplay this coming obstacle until they have a relationship with God, because then He'll help testify of things when it finally dawns on them what we really believe?"

Yeah, it is not a weak counter.   But not doing it now also turns a lot of former members into bitter former members who loudly yell about how they were lied to until baptism, then they really saw for the first time what we were, and the pressure to unlearn and re-think grew tenfold. 

IMO (and I'm not saying I'm right), if we love someone and respect their agency and the spirit of Christ that dwells within them, that includes telling the truth, and allowing them to make their own choices.

Edited September 24, 2023 by NeuroTypical

[askandanswer]

2 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

MO (and I'm not saying I'm right), if we love someone and respect their agency and the spirit of Christ that dwells within them, that includes telling the truth, and allowing them to make their own choices.

Yes, that's pretty much the approach I took. When I told him that he could not have both a same sex partner and membership in the church, it took him a while to recover from that. I think he had already started to come to that conclusion based on his reading of material at https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/same-sex-attraction?lang=eng but he was still unsure. Now he knows. I thought once he knew that, that would end his interest but I told him that did not need to be the end. I spoke about how there are some things that we can see the reason for, and other things we just have to accept by faith, and then I testified that obedience to God's commandments brings more happiness than any other choice. This empty, yearning, searching feeling that has been such a big part of his life seems to be big enough that the motivation to find a solution and fill that hole seems to be stronger than his desire to have a family. He is proceeding now on the basis of informed hope with a better understanding of the church's position on these matters.

[askandanswer]

6 hours ago, zil2 said:

I hope I'm not the only person here praying for this young man, whoever he is.

If he's willing, @askandanswer, perhaps some family history work (I know, right now he can only do research and make connections) would help to get him assistance from the other side of the veil, too.

Thanks Zil, I have been thinking about introducing him to family history research and the reason for it. I think it will help him to realise that he is part of a much larger family than just two parents on Earth, and that as a member of the church engaged in vicarious works for his deceased ancestors, there is a great deal he can do for his larger family. I had overlooked the possibility of his deceased ancestors being a source of assistance, but now that you raise it, that could be a very real source of assistance. 

[askandanswer]

5 hours ago, mikbone said:

Man… These are so hard.  And not my area of expertise.

Mental health, confusion, for all you know the young man could be attracted to you.  If you swoop in and solve his problems he may appreciate you as a mentor which could also be awkward emotionally.

My biggest concern is that he came to you with a presentation that he thought he might be gay.  He is straight-up Gay.  

This subterfuge or loose appreciation for truth and integrity is a red flag.  I’d refer him to the Bishop or (sister?) Missionaries so fast.

Yes, there was some subterfuge yesterday at church when he said he thought he is gay. When I reported to the missionaries last night after I got back home, it turns out that they know he is straight up Gay and that he has some mental health issues. The elder I spoke with said they have found it difficult to deal with those issues because of the counsel they have been given not to get involved in counselling and solving personal problems, but to focus on preaching the gospel. 

[askandanswer]

Update

He was baptised about an hour ago. I assisted with his confirmation. A new journey begins.

Edited January 7 by askandanswer

[NeuroTypical]

Yay!