Church issues statement on Pokemon Go app

[pam]

https://www.lds.org/church/news/popular-mobile-app-brings-visitors-to-church-facilities?lang=eng

We've grown accustomed to seeing people texting while walking, but lately have you noticed strangers wandering outside your local ward or stake building while expectantly staring into their phone's camera?

A hugely popular interactive mobile game released last week encourages players to visit various popular locations and landmarks. Some of those landmarks include LDS meetinghouses, visitors’ centers, historic sites, temples, and parks, which appear in many mapping software programs.

[NeedleinA]

Pokemon Go - You are welcome at our church!

1. View any visit as an opportunity.
2. Be friendly and welcoming.
3. Invite participation.
4. Become informed to better answer questions.  

5. Catch them all before others do!

[prisonchaplain]

This game has stirred a bit of controversy amongst Christians of the more conservative persuasion. After all, what are "pocket monsters" who use 'magic' powers?  So...are the participants really chasing demons?  I don't get crazy about such fads, but if I had young ones (<10) I'd probably discourage them. Anyone older, I'd just say, "Be ready to fast and pray...just in case."

[anatess2]

My son got roped into playing this game by his female friends/cousins who desire his services as "protector" as they go about public streets in search of pokemons.  I thought that was so cool that maidens still desire chivalry in this day and age...

Edited July 19, 2016 by anatess2

[pam]

34 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

This game has stirred a bit of controversy amongst Christians of the more conservative persuasion. After all, what are "pocket monsters" who use 'magic' powers?  So...are the participants really chasing demons?  I don't get crazy about such fads, but if I had young ones (<10) I'd probably discourage them. Anyone older, I'd just say, "Be ready to fast and pray...just in case."

I don't play the game but my kids do.  I guess I just don't see it as chasing demons and things like that.  Just a silly game.

[tesuji]

1 hour ago, prisonchaplain said:

This game has stirred a bit of controversy amongst Christians of the more conservative persuasion. After all, what are "pocket monsters" who use 'magic' powers?  So...are the participants really chasing demons?  I don't get crazy about such fads, but if I had young ones (<10) I'd probably discourage them. Anyone older, I'd just say, "Be ready to fast and pray...just in case."

Pokemon Go is completely innocuous. I can't imagine any rational Christian having a problem with it, unless for some reason they are 100% averse to all kinds of fantasy.

I did notice that of the two LDS churches that I visited while playing Pokemon Go, both were Pokestops or Poke Gyms.

I could imagine it becoming a nuisance, especially if people came chasing them into the building, or even the chapel. However, from my experience with the game, it's not necessary to enter buildings to catch them.

It's a brand new world, folks

Edited July 19, 2016 by tesuji

[estradling75]

3 minutes ago, pam said:

I don't play the game but my kids do.  I guess I just don't see it as chasing demons and things like that.  Just a silly game.

if your kids like the Pictures for the Pokestops and Gyms... they can thank the players of Ingress...  Because we were  Going... before Pokemon were

[Guest Godless]

My bar is a Gym, so I thought it would be cool to download the game and use screenshots for marketing purposes. I am now very thoroughly addicted to the game.

Edited July 19, 2016 by Godless

[prisonchaplain]

8 minutes ago, tesuji said:

Pokemon Go is completely innocuous. I can't imagine any rational Christian having a problem with it.

Well, err...:::cough:::...my good friend is a minister, and he's convinced that the innocuousness is the Devil's deceit. He was dead-set against Harry Potter too.  I'm not there, but part of me is sympathetic. After all, do we believe that "we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against spirits and principalities" or don't we?  In other words, I wonder if our trivializing the spirit realm is something of a disservice--especially to our younger children.

Just label me irrational--I'm not real comfortable with Halloween, either. 

[tesuji]

1 hour ago, prisonchaplain said:

Well, err...:::cough:::...my good friend is a minister, and he's convinced that the innocuousness is the Devil's deceit. He was dead-set against Harry Potter too.  I'm not there, but part of me is sympathetic. After all, do we believe that "we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against spirits and principalities" or don't we?  In other words, I wonder if our trivializing the spirit realm is something of a disservice--especially to our younger children.

Just label me irrational--I'm not real comfortable with Halloween, either. 

I don't see Pokemon as connected in any way with the spirit realm. it's pure imagination from the heads of Japanese animators.

Harry Potter, OK, that is talking about magic. However I read it as pure fantasy also. HP doesn't bear any resemblance to what little I know about actual Satanism and witchcraft.

I'm a person who enjoys fantasy, and even more so science fiction. I love Lord of the Rings, Dungeons and Dragons, Magic: The Gathering card game (although I don't play Black, creeps me out). Etc. So that's where I'm coming from.

If someone feels bad about getting into fantasy, then that's their right. I myself don't think there's some kind of slippery slope, from Pokemon into Satanism. I think for the most part, most fantasy is on a second, different slope, of harmless imagination.

Edited July 19, 2016 by tesuji

[tesuji]

Continuing...

I actually think fantasy is closer to dealing with gospel topics than most genres. In fantasy, you can have God and the supernatural participate in the story. You can't do that in sci fi, mystery, etc. - they are effectively atheistic. God, by convention, is not allowed to be a character in sci fi. You can't have the end of a traditional Agatha Christie type mystery novel being "God did the crime," or even Satan. Same for historic fiction, westerns, etc. a maybe a few other fiction genres.

Fantasy, of what I've seen, is often about good versus evil. It presents our real-world battle of good versus evil in more simplified or symbolic terms. Same with superhero fiction. Good guys battling evil.

So it's more possible to discuss and analyze how to fight evil in fantasy.

Also, interestingly, in fantasy and science fiction the author must create whole new worlds. A meaningful exercise? They are fantasy worlds, but the LDS scriptures say our world too was created spiritually (was a "fantasy") before it was created physically. 

Edited July 19, 2016 by tesuji

[estradling75]

1 hour ago, tesuji said:

 I can't imagine any rational Christian having a problem with it, unless for some reason they are 100% averse to all kinds of fantasy.

 

Did you mean to insult people...  or did you just not think it through?

Just because other think and believe differently then you is not a good reason to call them irrational...

After all I am sure you would not like an atheist calling you "irrational" because you believe in God... which is a totally irrational thing from what they think and believe.

[tesuji]

10 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

Did you mean to insult people...  or did you just not think it through?

Just because other think and believe differently then you is not a good reason to call them irrational...

After all I am sure you would not like an atheist calling you "irrational" because you believe in God... which is a totally irrational thing from what they think and believe.

No, I'm not trying to insult people. I honestly can't imagine it. I don't understand how they can think there's a problem with Pokemon. It doesn't seem rational to me. 

That doesn't mean I right and they are wrong. I've tried to explain my views on fantasy later in the thread (after the post you quoted). Pardon me if I've been a jerk, that wasn't my intention. 

Edited July 19, 2016 by tesuji

[estradling75]

18 minutes ago, tesuji said:

No, I'm not trying to insult people. I honestly can't imagine it. I don't understand how they can think there's a problem with Pokemon. It doesn't seem rational to me. 

That doesn't mean I right and they are wrong. I've tried to explain my views on fantasy later in the thread (after the post you quoted). Pardon me if I've been a jerk, that wasn't my intention. 

Fair enough... it was unintentional

But do you see how what you said could be insulting?

[tesuji]

3 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

Fair enough... it was unintentional

But do you see how what you said could be insulting?

I guess. Maybe if I had omitted the "irrational?" It's hard to express my feelings without using some of these kinds of words. Pokemon as demons seems ludicrous to me - see, that's probably offensive too.

To me it seems very superstitious. Or are they just afraid of human imagination? 

I have to assume these people don't know what fantasy is about, and just avoid it as a matter of principle? Perhaps people can explain it to me.

Perhaps it is like the case for me with horror. I feel horror is an unhealthy genre and will not watch or read it.

But fantasy is not like that for me. Sure there is unwholesome fantasy, but the whole genre is not like that. 

[estradling75]

Lets see if I can help you see it with a slight change in your own wording

2 hours ago, tesuji said:

Not believing in God is completely innocuous. I can't imagine any rational Person having a problem with it,

 

 

7 minutes ago, tesuji said:

I guess. Maybe if I had omitted the "irrational?" It's hard to express my feelings without using some of these kinds of words.  Believing in God seems ludicrous to me - see, that's probably offensive too.

To me it seems very superstitious.

Does that help?

[tesuji]

4 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

Lets see if I can help you see it with a slight change in your own wording

 

Does that help?

I get your point, but for me they are completely different. So your analogy doesn't speak to me very well.

It seems superstitious. It sounds like when Christians talk about angels having actual wings, or God creating the universe in 6 literal 24 hour days. 

It's OK, just ignore me and move on ...  

[prisonchaplain]

@tesuji No worries...but I am surprised that you do not understand the thinking. LDS believe in angels and demons, the same as "conservative Evangelicals." So, if demons are real, does it not make sense that some of us might be so cautious, we would want to avoid even the semblance of engaging them, or encouraging interaction? So, there are some Christians who won't do Halloween. Some avoided Harry Potter like the plague. Likewise with Pokemon (I don't know about the 'Go' version--just the original characters). It's not that we are afraid we'll be possessed. We just do not want to honor, interact with, or in any way encourage people to think lightly about the demonic. It's not a matter of fear, but of spiritual holiness.

I wonder if you are as easy-going about Ouija Boards?  Tarot Cards? Horoscopes? Seances?  If any those are a no-go for you, then you should be able to understand that some believers have drawn the line much sooner than you did.

[tesuji]

50 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

@tesuji No worries...but I am surprised that you do not understand the thinking. LDS believe in angels and demons, the same as "conservative Evangelicals." So, if demons are real, does it not make sense that some of us might be so cautious, we would want to avoid even the semblance of engaging them, or encouraging interaction? So, there are some Christians who won't do Halloween. Some avoided Harry Potter like the plague. Likewise with Pokemon (I don't know about the 'Go' version--just the original characters). It's not that we are afraid we'll be possessed. We just do not want to honor, interact with, or in any way encourage people to think lightly about the demonic. It's not a matter of fear, but of spiritual holiness.

I wonder if you are as easy-going about Ouija Boards?  Tarot Cards? Horoscopes? Seances?  If any those are a no-go for you, then you should be able to understand that some believers have drawn the line much sooner than you did.

Ok, I steer clear of all the things in your last paragraph 

The demons thing I don't understand though. Angels and demons are just people, right? What demons have to do With Pokemon?

[The Folk Prophet]

4 hours ago, tesuji said:

Pokemon Go is completely innocuous.

Well, now that's debatable. I agree in the terms set by PC. But "completely" innocuous in every way?

[SpiritDragon]

3 hours ago, prisonchaplain said:

@tesuji No worries...but I am surprised that you do not understand the thinking. LDS believe in angels and demons, the same as "conservative Evangelicals." So, if demons are real, does it not make sense that some of us might be so cautious, we would want to avoid even the semblance of engaging them, or encouraging interaction? So, there are some Christians who won't do Halloween. Some avoided Harry Potter like the plague. Likewise with Pokemon (I don't know about the 'Go' version--just the original characters). It's not that we are afraid we'll be possessed. We just do not want to honor, interact with, or in any way encourage people to think lightly about the demonic. It's not a matter of fear, but of spiritual holiness.

I wonder if you are as easy-going about Ouija Boards?  Tarot Cards? Horoscopes? Seances?  If any those are a no-go for you, then you should be able to understand that some believers have drawn the line much sooner than you did.

I think the disconnect may be due to actual familiarity with pokemon in general... have you ever watched the show or played the older video games PC? In the world of Pokemon (pocket monsters - a title that could lend itself to being thought of as demonic) it seems that every living creature besides humans is classified as a pokemon. Pokemon trainers go around and catch the various wildlife (pokemon) and learn more about themselves and the creatures around them, albeit through using their creatures to battle each other. Even so it is considered irresponsible to be neglectful about it or to allow the pokemon to get seriously injured - so it does seem fair to say it's not like dog-fights in our world.

Any how my main point is that perhaps it's hard to imagine how this is seen as sorcery or witchcraft from the perspective of knowing more about it. It is possibly analogous to someone not understanding the technology of a motor vehicle chalking them up to magic and voodoo that makes them move. Unless of course one is also against the idea of pets because they are worried that only witches keep pets with familiar spirits, I think that with greater understanding of the world of pokemon the fear of anything having to do with them could easily clear away. Of course as for using time for meaningful pursuits... I'll guarantee everyone can find something more important to do with their time.

[Sunday21]

I am proud of the LDS church for taking this approach! Also for the cool way that it has handled the Book of Mormon musical. I love the way the lds public affairs department has handled controversies. Have you heard the address of the guy who heads up the lds public affairs department.

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/full-transcript-michael-otterson-address-at-fair-mormon-conference

Seriously. One cool dude.

[tesuji]

37 minutes ago, Sunday21 said:

I am proud of the LDS church for taking this approach! Also for the cool way that it has handled the Book of Mormon musical. I love the way the lds public affairs department has handled controversies. Have you heard the address of the guy who heads up the lds public affairs department.

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/full-transcript-michael-otterson-address-at-fair-mormon-conference

Seriously. One cool dude.

I almost suspect that church PR has a healthy (mostly hidden) sense of humor, as I imagine God must have.

"The more you enjoy absurdity, the more entertaining this world becomes." - me

[Sunday21]

18 minutes ago, tesuji said:

I almost suspect that church PR has a healthy (mostly hidden) sense of humor, as I imagine God must have.

"The more you enjoy absurdity, the more entertaining this world becomes." - me

Yes! I am sure that you are right! For example, platypus. Could you create the platypus without a sense of humor? No way.

[anatess2]

On 7/20/2016 at 8:46 PM, tesuji said:

Ok, I steer clear of all the things in your last paragraph 

The demons thing I don't understand though. Angels and demons are just people, right? What demons have to do With Pokemon?

Not in any major Christian faith outside of LDS.  Angels and Demons are different beings than people just like God is a different being as well.