Child protection

[An Investigator]

Hi!

 

As everyone knows I am getting baptised in May,  I have started to take my Son to Church with me at the moment he attends the Nursery.. anyway I have found out that they are a bit short of cover down there and most people step in at one time and another and that no one has a CRB check.   I don't know how that sits with me to be honest,  older kids maybe but my son cant speak and he is potty training at the minute.  I'm not sure if to speak to the bishop or someone?  or to just stay to sacrament till my kids are older or am I just being paranoid as I was raised a Catholic and all this Spotlight stuff has come out recently?  Any thoughts?

 

Edit- Obviously I don't believe my son is any immediate danger or anything,  just really surprised that there is no background checks or anything.

 

 

Edited March 5, 2016 by An Investigator

[omegaseamaster75]

Speak with your bishop, You can stay with your child in the nursery until you feel comfortable with the individuals in there. If it is a revolving door of people in and out I would have a problem with it.

Edited March 5, 2016 by omegaseamaster75

[The Folk Prophet]

There are parents who do not put their children into nursery. Granted, it's usually because the kid won't stop screaming or the like. But if you aren't comfortable with it there's nothing forcing you to do so.

[Vort]

Congratulations on your baptism.

I have never heard of anyone getting a background check when receiving a Church calling. I understand your concern, but I have never shared it, not as a Nursery leader and not as a parent. I guess it might make sense to talk to the bishop about it, but just to prepare you, the bishop is not going to institute a background checking policy on nursery leaders. That sort of decision would have to come down from Salt Lake, and it would certainly be prohibitively expensive.

[An Investigator]

I used to be a Church Warden in my other Church and we had to do loads of Child protection stuff for the Sunday School.  I would suspect its more of an issue as I don't really know anyone well at Church at the minute just faces.   I understand that the a background checking policy would Church wide.

[Jane_Doe]

It is true, Nursery leaders do not receive background checks, neither do Primary workers.  Part of this is just the logistical feasibility- lay leadership where almost everyone works with kids at some point in time, versus other churches where it's a few people's paid job.  There's also a difference in the kids too:  Mormon classes are smaller: kids, parents, and teachers all know each other, versus some Christian churches I've been to where no one knows anyone and the children are literally assigned numbers.  

A couple of things about Mormon nursery/primary which might be of interest for you-- 

* If there's an issue, the teachers will bring the kid to you (cause they know you and where you hang out)

* If you son has to go potty or has a stinky diaper, the teachers will bring the kid to you-- they do ZERO bathroom stuff.

* Nursery is always taught by multiple adults (mine has ~6) in a single room where there's no "hiding spots" even for a two-year-old.  This is for safety, but also sanity of the teachers.

* All classrooms have windows to the inside and outside.  If you want, feel free to peak in (I do every week because it makes me smile to see little girl having a good time).

* If a kid has a sniffles, they ask you not to bring them to nursery.

* If you want, you could volunteer to stay in nursery with your son, or have him come to grown-up class with you.

Edited March 5, 2016 by Jane_Doe

[The Folk Prophet]

Generally a bishop is in a better position to know who might be a danger to children and who might not. In point of fact, one of the progressive complaints out there is that certain people with certain proclivities supposedly get a mark on their records and are never allowed to have certain callings with youth or children again.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Generally a bishop is in a better position to know who might be a danger to children and who might not. In point of fact, one of the progressive complaints out there is that certain people with certain proclivities supposedly get a mark on their records and are never allowed to have certain callings with youth or children again.

That complaint likely comes from the same complainers who complain that nursery isn't safe/secure enough. And everything else they complain about.

[Guest]

The only people who get CRB Checks as far as I know are those in the Scouting program.  But we generally have a two-deep leader principle in most younger classes as well.  But depending on availability of personnel, sometimes it is not followed with the strictness that it should be.  And some bishops simply don't apply it for whatever reason.

But, as Omega said, I'd also be upset at a revolving door of people, too.  And I am very comfortable with most of the families in my ward.

Edited March 6, 2016 by Guest

[NeedleinA]

Just as a fun little FYI:

There are some cases where "background checks" are run for certain callings.
1. Some states require background checks to be a Seminary Teacher.
2. Some countries require Missionaries to have background checks before entering them.
 

[kapikui]

On 3/5/2016 at 11:00 AM, Vort said:

Congratulations on your baptism.

I have never heard of anyone getting a background check when receiving a Church calling. I understand your concern, but I have never shared it, not as a Nursery leader and not as a parent. I guess it might make sense to talk to the bishop about it, but just to prepare you, the bishop is not going to institute a background checking policy on nursery leaders. That sort of decision would have to come down from Salt Lake, and it would certainly be prohibitively expensive.

Any Scouting callings must as per BSA rules. 

[Vort]

46 minutes ago, kapikui said:

Any Scouting callings must as per BSA rules. 

True enough. I had a "background check" of sorts before my Scouting calling. If "background check" means checking for any legal action against someone, then perhaps such a policy could be implemented, or perhaps already is. I was envisioning a "background check" as something more extensive (and expensive).

[Sunday21]

In my country such background checks are expensive. Most of people working with kids in my ward could not afford it.

[thoughts]

Parents are asked to take their nursery children to the potty and change their child's diapers.   So just make sure they know where to find you.  (Members try to do either between the meetings so no one needs to find them.)

But if you are uneasy, you absolutely may stay in nursery with your child.  Or you may take your child with you to your classes.

[NeuroTypical]

Hi Investigator,

I can speak to this a little.  No, LDS folks don't do background checks, at least not on the ward/unit level.  That said, mormons are in a position lots of churches are not.  When you get baptized, you get a record which appears on the rolls of the church.  As long as you're a baptized member, whether you're active or not, your record will be held in the ward/branch you reside.  This record, for 99% of us, contains the basic info - birthdate, date of ordinances, parents and children, that sort of thing.  There is, for that 1% you and I are concerned about - predators up to no good - a way to annotate a record.  

People who commit acts that would show up in a background check like child abuse or spousal abuse, will often have their record annotated with that information.  As one of these people moves from place to place, the bishop/branch president receives the record and reads the annotation.  This helps them select the right calling for such folks.  Ex-felons who have done horrible things have a place in this church, but we also have a duty to protect the flock.  So, someone may be the most repentant, reformed sinner in the world, but if you once abused a child, your days in nursery are pretty much done.  And we have a way to make sure that stays true even if you move to a new ward/branch.  Plenty of callings don't involve working with the youth.  

Oh yeah - and absolutely feel free to discuss such things with someone - bishop or home teacher or EQ pres or someone.  If they don't know they can find out.  Everyone should know IMO, so it's good to ask because it helps people understand the need to be informed.

Hope this helps.

Edited March 8, 2016 by NeuroTypical

[EarlJibbs]

I support attending a few times to get comfortable with the nursery leaders. When we moved into our new ward we didn't know anyone. We had to stay in the nursery for a while to get my daughter acclimated. I remember after the first time we caught one of the leaders using Clorox sanitary wipes (the heavy duty ones that you use to clean your kitchen with ) to clean the children's hands before the snacks. This was way overboard for my girl as she has super sensitive skin. We reminded them for a few weeks in a row that she couldn't use them. Other parents caught on and asked that they not use those on their children either. Instead they used something much less severe. We asked that my daughter just use a regular wipe, or we would come by and take her to the bathroom to clean up. 

The nursery leaders weren't bad people with bad intentions. But I think you should know who you are dealing with and how they are treating your children. They also didn't know my daughter and having me in there for a few weeks helped them as well. 

[NightSG]

Background checks wouldn't have helped here.

http://heavy.com/news/2016/03/jared-anderson-san-antonio-texas-judson-teacher-sex-parties-boys-mormon-youth-pastor-photos-wife-children/

[NeuroTypical]

Yep - these guys are the predators that all our efforts go to prevent.  

Quote

“The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has zero tolerance for abuse of any kind. When we learned of the situation, local leaders reported it immediately to law enforcement. Anderson has been removed from all responsibilities within the local congregation,” the church said in a statement to EAG News. “The Church is supportive of the efforts of authorities to investigate and prosecute this matter.”

It's important to note, that LDS bishops/branch presidents/stake presidents MUST obey all local, state, and federal laws regarding mandatory reporting.  The church has a toll-free number these leaders call when they hear news like this, which connects them to legal counsel which informs them of their various legal obligations to report.

Confession for just about anything is pretty much always private between confessor and confessee.  But for child abuse and elder abuse, there are laws in place that our church complies with.  

38 minutes ago, NightSG said:

Background checks wouldn't have helped here.

Something to consider: Dood will now go through the disciplinary process.  He may very well get excommunicated.  But if he figures he'll just move a town or a state away and get rebaptized and start a new boy's club, well, no he won't.  His record will probably end up annotated.  So yes, the current efforts underway will indeed help protect future potential victims. 

 

Edited March 21, 2016 by NeuroTypical

[letmeoff]

On 05/03/2016 at 4:51 AM, An Investigator said:

Hi!

 

As everyone knows I am getting baptised in May,  I have started to take my Son to Church with me at the moment he attends the Nursery.. anyway I have found out that they are a bit short of cover down there and most people step in at one time and another and that no one has a CRB check.   I don't know how that sits with me to be honest,  older kids maybe but my son cant speak and he is potty training at the minute.  I'm not sure if to speak to the bishop or someone?  or to just stay to sacrament till my kids are older or am I just being paranoid as I was raised a Catholic and all this Spotlight stuff has come out recently?  Any thoughts?

 

Edit- Obviously I don't believe my son is any immediate danger or anything,  just really surprised that there is no background checks or anything.

 

 

I think you would like to trust these people, but your doubts won't go away.

Try having a little faith in your new community, and see where that leads you.

[Backroads]

On 3/7/2016 at 3:36 PM, EarlJibbs said:

I support attending a few times to get comfortable with the nursery leaders. When we moved into our new ward we didn't know anyone. We had to stay in the nursery for a while to get my daughter acclimated. I remember after the first time we caught one of the leaders using Clorox sanitary wipes (the heavy duty ones that you use to clean your kitchen with ) to clean the children's hands before the snacks. This was way overboard for my girl as she has super sensitive skin. We reminded them for a few weeks in a row that she couldn't use them. Other parents caught on and asked that they not use those on their children either. Instead they used something much less severe. We asked that my daughter just use a regular wipe, or we would come by and take her to the bathroom to clean up. 

The nursery leaders weren't bad people with bad intentions. But I think you should know who you are dealing with and how they are treating your children. They also didn't know my daughter and having me in there for a few weeks helped them as well. 

 

I know this is an old thread I'm finally reading, but you wouldn't believe how many people think those heavy-duty cleaning wipes can be used for cleansing skin. My mentor teacher during student teaching did it. I finally asked her why, and she was surprised and horrified when I pointed out to the LABEL that says they're not supposed to be used for skin. I still see teachers doing it, and I always point out the label that just about every brand of these have on them: Do not use to clean skin.

I also had to tell my husband when our first one was tiny not to use them. He honestly thought that baby wipes/wet wipes/Clorox wipes were all the same thing.

It's a mass piece of confusion.