Guest Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 I used to attend the temple before I moved to Utah. I now am saddened to state that I cannot make myself go. I have had a few negative experiences in the temple (Utah) with workers and the worst, is I personally know of workers who are simply bad men. I am not their judge; however, I do believe in the sanctity of the temple. One individual is a sexual deviant among other things. I liken partaking of the temple ordinances directed by a hypocritical, dishonest, and immoral worker, similar to eating food from the hand of one whose hand has been in sewage. I don't really judge the hand, nor the sewage; nevertheless, it is dirty and invalid to be of nourishment. I know there will/may be the textbook answers: "Don't judge...Look to yourself"...and the like. I would like an intelligent response(s) and some spiritual guidance on what I can do. I want to return to the temple, but I feel it has been defiled. I hold a current recomend. Any thoughts? Quote
Vort Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 How is it possible that women and men can be simultaneously godly and wicked? All of us are wicked. All of us. We all offend God by our weakness and ungodliness. All of us are Godly. All of us (with perhaps very rare exceptions of those who have actively sought to extinguish all traces of God from their souls). We all have some aspect of divinity within us. What is our duty to ourselves? To seek to repress the wicked within us and to nurture the Godly. What is our duty to others? To forgive the wickedness we see in them, and to encourage and celebrate the Godly, that they might develop it even further. Backroads, beefche, Just_A_Guy and 2 others 5 Quote
Mike Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 @Vort Thanks. I like that. I reminds me of my duty, and it reinforces my hope for myself. Quote
Guest Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 (edited) I see a pattern in Enoch67's posts. Bemoaning others' faults, while claiming he's not judging. Edited February 28, 2017 by Guest Quote
Guest MormonGator Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 OP- When @Vort and I would give the same advice, it's probably a good idea to listen. We (Vort and I) don't agree on much but he's exactly right about this. Quote
anatess2 Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 1 hour ago, Enoch67 said: I used to attend the temple before I moved to Utah. I now am saddened to state that I cannot make myself go. I have had a few negative experiences in the temple (Utah) with workers and the worst, is I personally know of workers who are simply bad men. I am not their judge; however, I do believe in the sanctity of the temple. One individual is a sexual deviant among other things. I liken partaking of the temple ordinances directed by a hypocritical, dishonest, and immoral worker, similar to eating food from the hand of one whose hand has been in sewage. I don't really judge the hand, nor the sewage; nevertheless, it is dirty and invalid to be of nourishment. I know there will/may be the textbook answers: "Don't judge...Look to yourself"...and the like. I would like an intelligent response(s) and some spiritual guidance on what I can do. I want to return to the temple, but I feel it has been defiled. I hold a current recomend. Any thoughts? Don't judge.... look to your relationship with Christ at the temple... forgive 70x7 times. If this is impossible in that temple, go to another one. You say you're in Utah, there should be plenty of choices close by. I suggest driving at least 2 hours to go to another one. That way, you won't know anybody serving in that Temple and you can focus more on what's happening at the Temple instead of who's serving at the Temple. And you can use your 2 hours to prepare your heart for the blessings of the Temple. Good luck. a mustard seed, askandanswer and Backroads 3 Quote
Rhoades Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 Have you thought about traveling to another temple where you don't know the workers? Being in UT probably gives you that luxury. I'm reminded of a story my seminary teacher told me years and years ago. This seminary teacher became my stake president about 10 years after telling this story. He was in a meeting where a new priesthood leader was being sustained and he knew the guy had been involved in bad stuff. (He didn't share details with us.) He wasn't sure what to do, but he ended up raising his hand to oppose the sustaining. After the meeting was over, the leaders talked to him about it. I can't remember what all he taught us via this story, but there are times to speak up. Having an "accuser" is sometimes part of what helps sinners repent and helps to keep the integrity of the Church (see D&C 102). My teacher wasn't an evil guy for providing information about what he knew. He was one of the nicest guys I've ever known. I would consider counseling with your stake president about the matter. Just_A_Guy 1 Quote
Vort Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 20 minutes ago, MormonGator said: We (Vort and I) don't agree on much I disagree with this. NeedleinA, Fether, seashmore and 1 other 4 Quote
Guest MormonGator Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 2 minutes ago, Vort said: I disagree with this. "Looks like we're going to have to agree to disagree on this."-Ned Flanders "I don't agree with that."-Principal Skinner Quote
Jane_Doe Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 1 hour ago, Enoch67 said: I used to attend the temple before I moved to Utah. I now am saddened to state that I cannot make myself go. I have had a few negative experiences in the temple (Utah) with workers and the worst, is I personally know of workers who are simply bad men. I am not their judge; however, I do believe in the sanctity of the temple. One individual is a sexual deviant among other things. I liken partaking of the temple ordinances directed by a hypocritical, dishonest, and immoral worker, similar to eating food from the hand of one whose hand has been in sewage. I don't really judge the hand, nor the sewage; nevertheless, it is dirty and invalid to be of nourishment. I know there will/may be the textbook answers: "Don't judge...Look to yourself"...and the like. I would like an intelligent response(s) and some spiritual guidance on what I can do. I want to return to the temple, but I feel it has been defiled. I hold a current recomend. Any thoughts? Who said that going to the temple has anything to do with the temple workers? The ordinances you done there are not for the workers, nor are they done by the workers power, nor is it the workers that teach, nor is it really them directing anything. The temple is the LORD's house: He is the teacher there, His power forges the ordinances, and He directs His work. The work is done on behalf of those that He has washed clean, vast majority which have gone beyond the veil. The only person who can defile your experience at the temple is if you let something of the advisory into your soul there. Practically speaking: quit thinking about the sinful workers when this isn't tier house and it isn't about them. If for some reason you cannot quit thinking about the sins of the not-important-person, then I would suggest simply going to one of the other 17 temples in Utah where you do not know the workers. Quote
Vort Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 1 hour ago, MormonGator said: "Looks like we're going to have to agree to disagree on this."-Ned Flanders "I don't agree with that."-Principal Skinner Wait a minute. I want to be Ned Flanders. Quote
Vort Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 Wow. That has to be some sort of record for fastest account signup/deletion. Fether 1 Quote
Fether Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 3 hours ago, Guest said: I used to attend the temple before I moved to Utah. I now am saddened to state that I cannot make myself go. I have had a few negative experiences in the temple (Utah) with workers and the worst, is I personally know of workers who are simply bad men. I am not their judge; however, I do believe in the sanctity of the temple. One individual is a sexual deviant among other things. I liken partaking of the temple ordinances directed by a hypocritical, dishonest, and immoral worker, similar to eating food from the hand of one whose hand has been in sewage. I don't really judge the hand, nor the sewage; nevertheless, it is dirty and invalid to be of nourishment. I know there will/may be the textbook answers: "Don't judge...Look to yourself"...and the like. I would like an intelligent response(s) and some spiritual guidance on what I can do. I want to return to the temple, but I feel it has been defiled. I hold a current recomend. Any thoughts? Obviously we shouldn't judge, and I am not sure just telling you "don't judge others" will teach anything (won't even teach you not to judge) but we can't help but ignore the fact that there may be people who are unworthy performing our ordinances. We often times can fall under that. The same can be said about taking the sacrament. But why do we still take it the sacrament when those authorizing, preparing, blessing and passing it may be unworthy? The question I had was what is the difference between performing an ordinance unworthily and performing an ordinance without authority? Is there a difference? If not, that opens a whole slew of questions dealing with the authenticity of ordinances. FINAL THOUGHT: Worrying about other's worthiness will often keep us from the possibility of greater blessings in our own lives. You avoiding the temple is a good example. Try to be more selfish who cares about their unworthiness this is your salvation! (Maybe not the best way to think of it) seashmore 1 Quote
Fether Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 11 minutes ago, Vort said: Wow. That has to be some sort of record for fastest account signup/deletion. "They come they eat they leave" x) Sunday21 and Backroads 2 Quote
Guest Posted February 28, 2017 Report Posted February 28, 2017 21 minutes ago, Vort said: Wow. That has to be some sort of record for fastest account signup/deletion. No, he had posted once a few years ago. Then he left until today. That was the second OP where he dissed Utah Mormons, then left. That's what I meant when I said I see a pattern in his posts. I guess he decided to leave after his second attempt failed to elicit sympathy for his plight. Quote
Guest MormonGator Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 5 hours ago, Vort said: Wow. That has to be some sort of record for fastest account signup/deletion. That is unfortunate. We do not try to push people away. Quote
kapikui Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 43 minutes ago, MormonGator said: That is unfortunate. We do not try to push people away. I didn't see anything that should have pushed him away. Quote
Guest MormonGator Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 5 minutes ago, kapikui said: I didn't see anything that should have pushed him away. Good, I'm glad you didn't. You aren't the OP though, and they are the one who left. Perhaps we all could have been a little more understanding, myself included for sure. Quote
pam Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 1 hour ago, MormonGator said: That is unfortunate. We do not try to push people away. No but unfortunately it is happening more and more on this site. I'm getting requests for accounts to be deleted more frequently than I ever have. And they usually cite the rudeness of the site members. And there was a post in this thread that might cause me to want to leave as well. And I'll leave it at that. Jane_Doe 1 Quote
Guest Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 32 minutes ago, pam said: No but unfortunately it is happening more and more on this site. I'm getting requests for accounts to be deleted more frequently than I ever have. And they usually cite the rudeness of the site members. And there was a post in this thread that might cause me to want to leave as well. And I'll leave it at that. Please don't leave us! If you go, and the site were to go, I'd have to migrate to the LDS Freedom Forum (shudder)... Quote
pam Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 4 minutes ago, DoctorLemon said: Please don't leave us! If you go, and the site were to go, I'd have to migrate to the LDS Freedom Forum (shudder)... Let me rephrase that. If I had been the OP, there is a post in this thread that might cause me to leave as well. I'm not going anywhere. And heaven forbid you should have to go to LDSFF. Bunch of heathens. Jane_Doe and Sunday21 2 Quote
Guest MormonGator Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 12 hours ago, pam said: No but unfortunately it is happening more and more on this site. I'm getting requests for accounts to be deleted more frequently than I ever have. And they usually cite the rudeness of the site members. And there was a post in this thread that might cause me to want to leave as well. And I'll leave it at that. I sincerely apologize to anyone if I come across as rude. Quote
pam Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 15 minutes ago, MormonGator said: I sincerely apologize to anyone if I come across as rude. Apology accepted. You are rude to me all of the time. I kid of course. Sunday21 1 Quote
askandanswer Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 18 minutes ago, pam said: You are rude to me all of the time. Well done Gator, keep up the good work. (Just 11 more posts until Pam makes it to 50,000!) Quote
anatess2 Posted March 1, 2017 Report Posted March 1, 2017 12 hours ago, pam said: Let me rephrase that. If I had been the OP, there is a post in this thread that might cause me to leave as well. I'm not going anywhere. And heaven forbid you should have to go to LDSFF. Bunch of heathens. Hope it wasn't mine. What else can I say but the things he told us not to say... It's the correct answer. I had to say it before I can expand on it. Quote
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