Misshalfway

I'm sorry. Maybe I read you wrong but didn't you say that you had concealed the sexting conversations from your husband and your bishop? If you are harboring doubts and guilt about this, you need to come clean just so your mind will rest regardless of the way the bishop may react. Most likely you'll just confess and that will be the end of it. Not sure with your husband. He says he trusts you and has forgiven you. But if he knew about the sexting, would he be able to say that completely? Don't let this little thing fester. Clean it out. Clean it out.

Yes. Tell the bishop. Clear your involvement with this man completely. Then you'll truly be able to move on.

What do you mean by "leftist" exactly?

Woods, rivers, walks, and neighbors? Feels like coming home! You've won me already.

For those of you who live outside of Utah, and like it that way, would you mind sharing why you like it? And maybe where you live? (if you feel comfortable.) You see I live in Utah, but I'm thinking seriously about leaving. I've lived in Utah most of my life. I've had some experience with the church in other parts of the country, but for the most part the Utah LDS culture is all I have known. I've thought a lot about the Northwest US. But I'd love some good old fashioned opinions. Truthfully, I'd like to find a place/ward/neighborhood that feels inviting and nonjudgmental and family oriented. Is it possible to find all of that outside the concentrated ward situation of Utah? Thanks.

Yeah. I can see why that works for both of you. Sounds like you've been able to create safety so both voices are heard and considered. I think creating that safety takes efforts on both sides. You gotta watch what you say and how you say it, but you all have build tolerance for your spouses comments. If one or the other is out of balance, it's yuck.

I've never felt comfortable with the teaching that by nature women are more righteous than men. In my soul, I feel that men and women have equal capacity for both righteousness and wickedness. Although, I wouldn't mind getting extra points for having to go through labor pains. On the subject of polygamy, I just can't stomach it. As I balance all the stuff we do know, and all the stuff we don't, and all the speculation, and all the arguments either way......I still find the idea of sharing my husband repulsive. And I know very few men than can handle even the thought of sharing their wives. But men haven't been asked to sacrifice in this way. So, I don't think men fully appreciate what this means for women (not all of course.) Perhaps I'm wrong. I actually hope I'm wrong. And....Of course I'd submit to the will of the Lord. But that is different than liking it. Obeying polygamy on earth for a short period to fulfill the short term need of the Lord is one thing. Doing it with my eternity...the one that is suppose to be filled with rest....well, that is something else. I don't see myself being happy for eternity if I'm not equally yoked in fidelity with my spouse.

That IS really cool, Anatess. I don't have a garden, but I really want one. I'm not a green thumb and the whole business rather intimidates me. But I'm truly a wannabe.

Hi Specka. Welcome to the forums. I've read a few of your posts. Glad to have you.

Trust me. Women want men to be noble. Problem is.....when we ask for that, we get told we are critical and that we are emasculating them. What are we suppose to do? Tell men they are awesome when they are not? Or wait year after year placating them hoping they'll get it? And Heck! I'll be Clair Huxtable. To be a mother AND have a career AND have a husband who isn't threatened by my smarts or my opinions or my weaknesses. To have a husband that didn't need me to dummy down or suppress my emotional nature? Wow! I'd do that any day.

Yeah. This "forks over knives" documentary talks about how the diary and meat groups are so powerful in Washington and how they get all the funding. The food guide pyramid was even changed to support these two industries. Interesting.

Welcome to the boards. You say you've experienced this sudden doubt about remarrying. Are you currently engaged? Or are you considering getting back on the market?

Add a "Ditto" from me. Sometimes we have to act our way to the "burning" instead of needing to feel it before we act. You, my dear, have been through so much! I'm reading that OP and I marvel that your desire is still there to seek spiritual things. And I love what Anddenex said about how coming to Christ is the thing that makes us feel better. I actually really needed to hear that. Going to church and going through the motions....it's really hollow.

First of all, it's ok to struggle with your testimony. We don't talk about this a lot because everybody is afraid of it. We think doubt is a sign of weakness. But remember that there is opposition in ALL things. We need the opposition because it helps us to grow. OK? So be grateful for you doubt. Without the doubt, your faith would not develop into the strong thing it can be. Breath in a big sigh of relief on this and let yourself relax. God isn't afraid of our doubt. So why should we be? He helps us with it, yes. But he isn't afraid. He, above all, understands processes and he understands adversity. In fact He sent us here to experience it. His teaches "line upon line", right? And he uses obstacles to make us stronger. So.....you are doing exactly as God would wish. Sounds pretty awesome to me. Who cares if your testimony doesn't come like all the Ensign stories. (IMO...we do lots of disservice by all that whitewashing). If you can, imagine a loving God who is ok and supportive of your process. Imagine a God who isn't panicky and preachy like all of those well-meaning "testifying" humans. Instead see a Father and a friend that is SO invested in your progression that He allows struggle. He is SO wise that He knows when to stir the batter and when to let the cake bake. Get my meaning? And in these last days, I don't think He is building flimsy testimonies. I think He is building durable layered knowings inside of us. Knowledge yes, but wisdom too. So....relax. And let Him work in you. He must trust you a great deal. Now....once you let yourself get ok with being in process and ok with no needing picture perfect outcomes today, you can get to the business of faith building. Maybe spend some time in Alma 32. We need to "give place" and then plant the seed. Then we need to nurture the seed to grow. Why do you just do that for a while? You say you don't like the lack of standards in the world. So....at least you know that you prefer living with higher standards. So...obey the WofW & LofC. Let the blessings of that discipline work in you. Listen to the insights that occur to you as you do. Those are the "line upon lines". While you do that....start to believe in stuff. What I mean is "act as if". That means you act as if the Holy Ghost was real. You act as if the Atonement was real and that Jesus made a way for you and me to be clean from the blood and sins of this generation. And you "let that work in you". And just like all of us have to with our veggie gardens, allow yourself to wait in patience and gratitude. If you get a little insight here and a little there, be grateful for that. Don't "need" spiritual confirmation. Picture that you will get it at the right time and that you are just waiting with surety. I think what I'm leading you to is walking in trust. Trust that God won't lead you astray. Trust the scriptures that God answers prayers. Trust that God will lead you with pillars of fire and smoke through the wilderness. Trust that He'll give you manna too. Yeah He does it in His own wise way and His own strange timing. But trust that He is leading you to the best things. Sorry. But I'm going to testify now. I just came out of a four year battle with, and for, my current testimony. For me, I had a strong testimony in my youth and young adulthood. But God took it away from me for a time. I didn't believe in God for a time. I doubted every doctrine of the church. I doubted every part of the earthly church structure. I stopped going to church. I even tried to break the WofW. But all I could do was buy black tea and look at the box in my cupboard. (Not very impressive I know. I guess my faith was stronger than I thought. :) ) During this time, I was very afraid. I didn't tell very many people about my struggle. And I was right not too. Most rank and file mormon's can't handle this stuff. They have to judge, bless them. But I made some early decisions about my journey. I decided to trust God. Well, after I started to believe in Him again. And this was the best thing I ever did. He started to talk to me. He explained that he was reworking my testimony and that I needed, for His wise purpose, to understand what it was like to not have my testimony. He told me He would heal me, but that it would be painfully slow. And that He knew I would protest but that I needed to trust Him. I HAVE protested ALOT! Lot of long midnights of prayer and complaining. But also tear filled prayers filled with gratitude. And now that much of the struggle is over for me, I wouldn't change my experience for anything!! I don't need whitewashed Ensign stories anymore. I don't need other's picture perfect tear-jerker stories to confirm my faith to me. God gave me something better. Well.....He isn't done yet. He is giving me something better.....and certainly broader. So girlie.....you dig deep. You gather your strength to exercise faith. I have to believe that good things will come to you if you do. Best.

Sorry....forgot the link. Forks Over Knives | Official Website This is the official webpage. You can locate the film at the top. It's also on Hulu.

I think this is a really important thread. And I think we need to talk about it more in the church. A lot more. Just talking about the "do not" list and congratulating ourselves cuz caffinated soda is now "Ok"....is completely missing half the point. The more I study, the more I feel that the WofW was a code of protection to us. We live in a day and age where addictions of all kinds are common place. We have epidemic health problems such as heart disease and diabetes. I really think the WofW is designed to help us with all of these things. And I agree that it is about the health of the spirit as well as the body, but lets not forget the importance of the body! I've just watched a video called "Forks Over Knives" (linked below). It talks about how the Western diet with high consumption of animal based products and low focus on fruit, veggies, and whole grains is making us fat and sick and dead. So, I don't know. The WofW doesn't say to eliminate meat. But it does say "sparingly". And it emphasizes veggies, fruits, and whole grains. I don't think the WofW advocates high carbs. We need the right kinds of carbs. Not all the processed refined stuff. And I don't like the implication that suggesting such a shift makes everyone unworthy to have a temple recommend. God said He would not command in all things. I think this idea applies here. God isn't going to regulate everything. He gives us each the stewardship of our own bodies. And he let's imperfect people go to the temple because we need it! If a person wants to drown their body with soda pop and steak, I don't think God needs to punish the person. The tired, fat, sick thing does a pretty good job on its own.

Maybe the bishop is avoiding you. Maybe he isn't. Who knows. Perhaps he overpromised something to you when he shouldn't have spoken yet. Maybe he is embarrassed. Maybe he feels your angst-ish energy about being lied to and he just doesn't know how to deal with your out of balance emotions. Look. Crap happens. It happens in life and in the church. Ward mission leader is a huge and awesome calling! Let the past go and dive into this new opportunity. If working with this autistic person was your wish, why do you need a calling to do that? Go waste and wear out your life. And forgive your bishop. You weren't lied to. Life just happened.

Hi Marriageinprogress. Let me start with a huge hug. Finding out about your husband's porn problem must have been devastating for you. It was for me when I first discovered my husband had been using and lying for years of our marriage. It felt like a tornado swept through my whole life. I was hurt and confused ..... and I got a ton of pressure to forgive and to forgive fast. He pressured me. His father did. And my bishop too. I was told that if I didn't forgive, I didn't deserve my temple recommend. And that was before he even started recovery! I said "BUNK!" to that then and I say "BUNK" to that now. You just had a personal sized hiroshima hit your heart. You are still in shock! How could you possibly be expected to forgive completely when you are still trying to understand what happened? It's ok that you can't forgive yet. The fact that you are worried about it says enough about your character to satisfy any loving God. Give yourself a huge dose of patience and compassion. Forgiveness is a process with different parts and different stages. And I think it's different for everyone. I think you are exactly where you should be in your process and I have faith that God knows exactly where you are and exactly what you need. Hand the forgiveness to Him for now. Forgiveness is often a gift from heaven anyway. He'll help your heart and spirit to heal. And when that is complete enough, you'll feel the forgiveness ebb out of your heart. it might be an event. It might happen a bit at a time. But it can and will happen. But not yet. It's just too soon. I'm wondering, dear sister, if you might be confusing forgiveness with trust. I know that I had to figure out the difference. I thought that if I didn't trust him that I wasn't forgiving. I know now that the two are mutually exclusive. I look back and forgiveness has actually been easier than trusting again. I became so used to lies and manipulations. So used to being blindsided by the next horrifying discovery. And at the same time, I loved him and had so much compassion for how he got stuck and why he stayed stuck in such a difficult predicament. Remember you have experienced a trauma. Your brain is trying to protect you the same way mine did for me. By scanning for danger and putting up walls. That doesn't mean you aren't a forgiving person. It doesn't mean you don't have faith or a loving heart. It means you have been hurt and that the safety in your marriage has been blown apart. As your husband learns to stop hiding and to tell the truth.....as he learns how to show restitution by being transparent with his actions and emotions......you will learn how to trust again. If he doesn't do this work, there is no expectation that you should trust any sooner than is appropriate. Remember that this is HE made the mess and now he has to clean it up. He has to earn back that trust. He needs to earn it back to restore his own integrity and self respect. So expecting that is a loving thing. And know that as you develop an understanding of what porn addiction is and isn't... and as you develop compassion for your husband's maladaptive ways of coping, that forgiveness and grace will come to you. Trust the healing process. Trust your brain. It knows how to mourn losses and how to guide you to healing. And trust Father in Heaven. Your needs are known. And there is no need or expectation from heaven that you run faster than you have strength. God does things by processes......long long processes. He took millions of years to make the earth. I don't think He is too scared if forgiveness takes longer than 2 months. :) Blessings be with you, my dear. You are not alone. And neither is your husband. May healing and forgiveness come to you both. Two books you might find helpful: "Your Sexually Addicted Spouse: How partners cope and Heal" by Barbara Stephens "How Can I Forgive You? The courage to forgive, the freedom not to" by Janis Abrahms Spring

There have been a couple of times when I've wondered about this with some neighbors. One family I know has many children. And their usually isn't much time between pregnancies. There were times when I wondered about the money issue and heard they were using the bishop for expenses. Soon they were on the 15th child. The last few were born too early and lived in the NICU for months. And mom didn't fare much better. I think her kidney's were in serious trouble at one point. Listening to this mom talk about how much she loved babies but didn't like it when they got older, made me wonder if she was kind of addicted to having a newborn. So...I know I can judge. But I've wondered. I have other friends that also wanted and planned to have a large family. But they've made all the provisions. And they know their limits. It feels like they are doing it right. The former story....I'm just not sure.

Oh Wing! Sorry you are having this kind of bad day. I remember when my kids used to do this. I was a stay at home mom and my husband worked. I wondered sometimes if the kids just missed him and that maybe that was the root of their favoritism. Or...maybe we just got sick of each other cuz we were together so much. Daddy was the novelty. But even if you understand all that it doesn't prevent it from really hurting sometimes. My oldest had some attachment issues right at first. He wouldn't look at you in your face and bond with you like the other kids. He is 14 now and I am just now finding a bonding connection with him that I've been longing for all these years. The other day he cuddled up next to me on the couch put his arms around my neck and said, "I love you mom." I had to hold back all the tears. All 14 years of them. Being a mom IS one of the hardest, thankless jobs some days. But know that all of your diligence and hard work and nurturing sacrifices are allowing that sweet girl the freedom the have emotional experiences in front of you. You are a great mom, Wing! It will turn around. (I know you know that, but I'll reassure anyway. )

As a side note, not every man wants sex. Many men struggle with low sex drive (amongst other problems that impact sex drive) and it's their wives who are sex starved left wondering why he doesn't want her. I guess what I'm saying is that every couple is different and that we get told a lot of hoopla sometimes.

If you are sincerely apologizing for something you've done, or some outcome that you regret, I would hope that it such doesn't equal weakness. I would hope that means that a person really cares about others. But I do think that sometimes people get into the habit of apologizing for everything to the point that they apologize for living. I do think there is weakness in this and that perhaps people sense it. I have a friend who apologizes for everything she says and is. She is sure she's offended someone before she even thinks the thought. I love her to death and I forgive her completely for this because I know her history. But still, it does get a little tired sometimes and it gets in the way. It makes me feel that she doesn't trust me to be anything but critical or easily offended. I wish she wasn't so afraid of such judgment, at least from me. But even saying all that, it might help if you were a bit more specific about what you are driving at. There are lots of kinds of apologies. Some of them are great, some are weak, and some are pointless.

Great example, Judo.

Wow. I guess I didn't realize it was that bad. I'm sorry it's not a good relationship. That certainly makes things more difficult and complicated. If I were in your shoes, I'd probably be just as terrified. Do you have older siblings, by chance? If so, how do they handle your parents? Would you feel more comfortable if you didn't need their money for school? Is there any way for you to take on that responsibility? Maybe a student loan or something. I know school can be very expensive.

Of course its a matter of loyalty. In what part of my remarks do you think I champion or excuse such behavior? And I must say I'm 42 and been an active member my whole life and I don't think I've ever had that experience in RS meetings. The other night I was at a party and a man was there without his wife. It was embarrassing and appalling the way he disparaged her. And I think everyone in the room felt uncomfortable. Including me. I'm not quite sure what you are arguing with. I think....I think I made myself clear that such abuse would absolutely be damaging no matter who it was inflicted upon. No. I think you are missing my point completely. Again, I'm trying to understand what behaviors specifically emasculates men....behavior that apparently women in the church are doing regularly. And I'm really hoping to iron out some of my confusion as I try to understand what I think I see. You said, "being critical". And I've noted that. Thank you.