Mormon Social Justice Warriors up in arms about the Mormon Tabernacle Choir

[Vort]

The Mormon Tabernacle Choir is singing at Donald Trump's presidential inauguration. To the surprise of absolutely no one, the snowflaky hypocrites of the Mormon Social Justice League are whining about it. Make no mistake, had the Tabernacle Choir been asked to sing at Obama's inauguration, the overwhelming majority of these crybabies would have been bubbling over with how wonderfully "progressive" such a move was.

Moral: Those who whine about the Tabernacle Choir singing at Trump's inauguration are a humiliation to themselves and all who know them, and deserve to be studiously ignored.

[Just_A_Guy]

Look, the guy's a liar, amoral, generally hostile to Gospel values, and very probably a rapist.  I'm not thrilled about it either. 

I think the best thing that can be said for the move is that MoTab is supposed to be first and foremost goodwill ambassadors; and sometimes even Trumpkins need a little goodwill. 

Edited December 22, 2016 by Just_A_Guy

[Vort]

I don't like the guy either, JAG. That is not the point. Had the vomitous Hillary Clinton won and then, for some bizarre reason, asked the Mormon Tabernacle Choir to perform at her inauguration, I have little doubt they would have accommodated her request. And as much as I would have disliked any potential appearance of the Church approving of her as president, I would have supported that decision as correct.

Same here. The only difference is the rank hypocrisy of the vast majority of those doing the whining.

[Backroads]

I just thought it vaguely cool they were singing at a presidential inauguration. That was as far as my thoughts went.

[Just_A_Guy]

11 minutes ago, Vort said:

I don't like the guy either, JAG. That is not the point. Had the vomitous Hillary Clinton won and then, for some bizarre reason, asked the Mormon Tabernacle Choir to perform at her inauguration, I have little doubt they would have accommodated her request. And as much as I would have disliked any potential appearance of the Church approving of her as president, I would have supported that decision as correct.

Same here. The only difference is the rank hypocrisy of the vast majority of those doing the whining.

I think it depends on which reactions you're condemning.  There's a lot of melodramatic, "today I'm ashamed of my church, blah blah blah" going on; and I pigeonhole that with the other leftist histrionics we've been seeing since election day.  But other folks--myself included--recognize the necessity of the move while still being deeply uncomfortable with it; and we would have felt similarly even if it were Hillary's inauguration that MoTab was singing at.

For every leftist whining about how this performance smacks of a formal church "endorsement" of Trump's antics, I daresay there's a Trump supporter who's smugly asserting--or at least thinking--the same thing. 

Edited December 22, 2016 by Just_A_Guy

[NeuroTypical]

Trump is a schmoozer.  A deal maker.  He doesn't make enemies unless he needs to, and he doesn't keep them unless he needs to.  And he made enemies of a lot of Mormons, basically insulted us during the campaign to get a bit more christian votes.   So now he won, he's smoothing over ruffled feathers by doing us the honor of having MoTab do their thing at his inauguration. Nothing more, nothing less.  

[Vort]

4 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

For every leftist whining about how this performance smacks of a formal church "endorsement" of Trump's antics, I daresay there's a Trump supporter who's smugly asserting--or at least thinking--the same thing.

You may be right. And when the smug Mormon Trumpsters start filling up Facebook and other social media with their histrionics about the Mormon Tabernacle Choir performance being an endorsement of Their Guy, you can be sure I will call out their hypocrisy. So far, I haven't seen them. Just the hypocritical Lefties.

Edited December 22, 2016 by Vort

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

25 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Look, the guy's a liar, amoral, generally hostile to Gospel values, and very probably a rapist.  I'm not thrilled about it either. 

This sums it up pretty well.  

[Guest Godless]

Eh, whatever. The more interesting news to me is the fact that the honor of singing the National Anthem has been passed on from Beyonce to the 2010 runner-up of America's Got Talent. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy for the girl, but also amused by the lack of willing star power. It's going to be an interesting four years.

[NightSG]

16 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

Trump is a schmoozer.  A deal maker.  He doesn't make enemies unless he needs to, and he doesn't keep them unless he needs to.  And he made enemies of a lot of Mormons, basically insulted us during the campaign to get a bit more christian votes.   So now he won, he's smoothing over ruffled feathers by doing us the honor of having MoTab do their thing at his inauguration. Nothing more, nothing less.  

Or maybe (like a fairly large percentage of people outside the Church) he just likes their singing and knows they have a thing for patriotic songs.  Sounds ideal for a Federal event.

[NightSG]

15 hours ago, Godless said:

Eh, whatever. The more interesting news to me is the fact that the honor of singing the National Anthem has been passed on from Beyonce to the 2010 runner-up of America's Got Talent. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy for the girl, but also amused by the lack of willing star power. It's going to be an interesting four years.

Fairly sure there were plenty he could have gotten; Ted Nugent is still a big name, and I'm sure would have been highly honored to do his Star Spangled Banner guitar solo at the inauguration.

OTOH, I personally wouldn't mind seeing the whole thing done with just the Marine Band and one soloist for the anthem.

[Vort]

3 hours ago, NightSG said:

OTOH, I personally wouldn't mind seeing the whole thing done with just the Marine Band and one soloist for the anthem.

Agreed. That would be very nice.

[Just_A_Guy]

I think the plan is for Jackie Evancho to do the National Anthem. 

[wenglund]

20 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Look, the guy's a liar, amoral, generally hostile to Gospel values, and very probably a rapist.  I'm not thrilled about it either. 

I don't share your harsh judgement of the man or of his supporters (I happen to be one), but I agree somewhat with your point that the inauguration performance by the Choir isn't an endorsement of the candidate or party (the MTC has performed for both parties), but a goodwill mission. If anything, it is a gracious acceptance of the constitutional process, and sets an excellent example for us all.

Thanks, Wade Englund

[anatess2]

On 12/22/2016 at 5:11 PM, NeuroTypical said:

 And he made enemies of a lot of Mormons, basically insulted us during the campaign to get a bit more christian votes.

Disagree.  A lot of Mormons made an enemy of Donald Trump.  Trump had no beef with Mormons until Romney and Beck and their effort to use Mormons to defeat the Republican Party using McMullin was waged.

[Just_A_Guy]

4 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Disagree.  A lot of Mormons made an enemy of Donald Trump.  Trump had no beef with Mormons until Romney and Beck and their effort to use Mormons to defeat the Republican Party using McMullin was waged.

This is entertaining on so many levels, two of which are:

1)  The thoroughly unsubstantiated suggestion of a collusion between McMullin and either Romney or Beck; and

2)  The pirouette from Romney's and McMullin's representing "establishment Republicanism", to suddenly relegating them to outsider status and accusing them of plotting to "defeat the Republican Party". 

Now, I'll grant you this much:  There is an ideological conspiracy which runs afoul of Trump.  The problem (for Trump) is that neither man nor devil was the author of that conspiracy.

[Guest MormonGator]

It's not SJW's. I'm a registered republican and I'm not thrilled about it either.

[anatess2]

21 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

This is entertaining on so many levels, two of which are:

1)  The thoroughly unsubstantiated suggestion of a collusion between McMullin and either Romney or Beck; and

2)  The pirouette from Romney's and McMullin's representing "establishment Republicanism", to suddenly relegating them to outsider status and accusing them of plotting to "defeat the Republican Party". 

Now, I'll grant you this much:  There is an ideological conspiracy which runs afoul of Trump.  The problem (for Trump) is that neither man nor devil was the author of that conspiracy.

You can put your head in the sand all you like.  McMullin ran on Romney's machine.  Fact.  Even McMullin admitted it on TV.  The narrative they try to push on you which is that Romney had no collusion with McMullin nor Beck is about par for the course for the narrative that Trump is a racist, sexist, bigot.

Trump fought e-GOP.  When he became the Republican nominee, he took the Republican Party.  This is symbolized by Priebus loyalty to Trump all the way to him getting picked for Chief of Staff.  Never Trumpers at that point became anti-Republican.

But hey, I'm not re-litigating this election.  Every single day since Election Day has showed what Trump is about and why I campaigned for him.

Edited December 27, 2016 by anatess2

[Just_A_Guy]

1 hour ago, anatess2 said:

You can put your head in the sand all you like.  McMullin ran on Romney's machine.  Fact.  Even McMullin admitted it on TV.  The narrative they try to push on you which is that Romney had no collusion with McMullin nor Beck is about par for the course for the narrative that Trump is a racist, sexist, bigot.

You can put your head in the sand all you like, but Trump is neither honest, nor good, nor wise; and we have been explicitly warned about the dangers of putting his ilk in positions of political leadership. You can blame Romney, or David French, or Bill Kristol; but none of them (nor even the media) made Trump a serial womanizer and philanderer, a predatory casino-owner, a deadbeat who stiffed myriads of vendors, a flip-flopper who put Romney to shame, a false accuser, a liar par excellence --excuse me, master persuader--and a mammon-worshiping blasphemer who openly disavowed any need to seek forgiveness from on High for any aspect of his miserable life until it became politically expedient for him to do so.  Trump did all that himself, and made a calculated effort to incorporate those traits as thoroughly into his public image as he had into his private one. 

If some Latter-day Saints chose to take their own scripture seriously even as others were selling out, the holdouts can only represent the highest form of collusion: that between a creature and its Creator.  The Romney-as-puppetmaster paradigm doesn't square with Romney's demanding fair-market-value for Team McMullin to purchase his donor list; it doesn't square with the lack of contact between Romney and McMullin prior to McMullin's candidacy; it doesn't square with Romney's lack of an endorsement; it doesn't square with Romney's lack of financial or logistical support to the McMullin campaign. 

Slanders against McMullin/Romney and prolonged "otherization" of those few (yes, the "NeverTrumpers") whose souls are still their own, may be an effective short-term opioid against the pain of a pricked conscience.  But the value of such balm, like that all other Trumpian patent medicines, will prove ephemeral; as Trumpers slowly come to understand the spiritual and social bankruptcy of what they have done.  They don't yet understand--they never understood--that progressivism was the symptom, not the cause, of America's problems.  The cause was moral decay, and the Trumpers have just enticed the Republican Party into standing up to be counted as being in favor of more of it.  What of cabinet picks, federal judges, and a short-lived regulatory rollback?  None of that will be any match for the mischief effectuated by a materialistic, profligate, loveless electorate that has given up trying to determine "truth" and instead votes wholly with its gut. 

Quote

Trump fought e-GOP.  When he became the Republican nominee, he took the Republican Party.  This is symbolized by Priebus loyalty to Trump all the way to him getting picked for Chief of Staff.  Never Trumpers at that point became anti-Republican.

I think it's wonderful that Trumpers have finally decided that party loyalty is a virtue. 

Edited December 27, 2016 by Just_A_Guy

[Guest Godless]

1 hour ago, anatess2 said:

Trump fought e-GOP.  When he became the Republican nominee, he took the Republican Party.  This is symbolized by Priebus loyalty to Trump all the way to him getting picked for Chief of Staff.  Never Trumpers at that point became anti-Republican.

I would have been very shocked if the GOP leadership had shown any real resistance to Trump's victory in the primaries. Doing so would have designated them as heroes in some circles (both R and D), but it also would have virtually guaranteed a Clinton victory last month. Can't have that. In the end, party politics won out, just like it always does. The fact that some Republicans are still displeased by the result doesn't make them anti-Republican, it makes them anti-Trump. They were willing to concede this election to Clinton in order to avoid allowing Trump to define the GOP (and our nation) for the next 4-8 years. That's true party loyalty.

It's that kind of loyalty that drove many Sanders supporters to vote third party rather than support Hillary. Even now, there are movements forming on local levels to give the Democratic Party a much needed revamp in order to avoid another defeat in an election that could have easily been won. I've been saying quite a bit in recent weeks that dissent and critical attitudes represent the purest forms of patriotism. That's why it didn't take me long to forgive the Stein/Johnson voters, and that's why NeverTrumpers in the GOP shouldn't be marginalized. They continue to act according to their conscience towards achieving what they believe is best for both the GOP and the country even as GOP leaders line up to kiss Trump's golden glutes. As someone who very reluctantly voted for Clinton, I can't fault them for that.

[prisonchaplain]

I could see the controversy if the choir sang at a party convention. In this case, the US is installing a new president.  If we were commanded to pray for Caesar, then it should not be too controversial to sing for the new president.  One would think the church would feel honored to be invited.

[estradling75]

6 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

I could see the controversy if the choir sang at a party convention. In this case, the US is installing a new president.  If we were commanded to pray for Caesar, then it should not be too controversial to sing for the new president.  One would think the church would feel honored to be invited.

Indeed... while I am in no position to know for sure... I would assume that the Choir would sing at any presidential inauguration.  That the ones they have not sang at was because they were not invited to do so.  It has nothing to do about endorsing a president, and everything to do with doing their mission

[Guest MormonGator]

21 minutes ago, Godless said:

I've been saying quite a bit in recent weeks that dissent and critical attitudes represent the purest forms of patriotism.\

It's patriotic when the opposing side is in office and treason when your side is in office. 

[mirkwood]

4 hours ago, anatess2 said:

 A lot of Mormons made an enemy of Donald Trump.  Trump had no beef with Mormons until Romney and Beck and their effort to use Mormons to defeat the Republican Party using McMullin was waged.

Disagree.  Most Mormons voted for Trump.

[anatess2]

1 minute ago, mirkwood said:

Disagree.  Most Mormons voted for Trump.

A lot is not Most.  A lot is... just a lot.  So yes, most Mormons voted for Trump.  Even in Utah.

Okay, I'm done with this thread and every Trump thread where @Just_A_Guy and all others think Trump just short of devil incarnate.  The next 4 years will be here soon enough to tell us what Trump is made of.  The old Republican Party needed to die.  I am glad it is finally dead so we can breathe new life to the thing.  I am sorry you think the Republican Party is the poster children of upstanding morals.  They have been poster children for campaign promises only.  All posturing.  No substance.  Killing the country with legislative stupidity while they preserve their campaigns.  I am also glad it is causing Democrats extreme angst as well.  Hope they get their act straight and save their party from the divisiveness and extremism of identity politics and finally cut their tight grip on the major media outlets who are the kings of fake narratives.

Now go make America great again.  I'll go back to working on Philippine politics.