A World Without Electronics

[askandanswer]

23 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

My reading tastes are truly bizarre. I'll go to Daredevil comics to Elizabethan plays to transgressive fiction to suspense novels to pulp to 1920's modernist poetry. See @askandanswer? That's what a BA in English gets you. 

BAaaa humbug!

[Crypto]

6 hours ago, mrmarklin said:

The real problem with rear view cameras and detection is that one gets used to them and ignores all the beeps.  I backed out of a parking spot and into a car waiting for a red light.  Totally embarrassing.

User Error. The bane of tech support. 😅

[NightSG]

On 5/6/2018 at 10:23 AM, Carborendum said:

I almost want to be Amish. 

I was going to direct you to their website, but it's giving a SQL error.  (Seriously.  I mean, can a joke write itself any more thoroughly?)  Must be hard to find good IT help in that community.

On 5/6/2018 at 10:23 AM, Carborendum said:

When she got off the phone, a coworker asked her if she at least had a GPS unit in the car.  No.  She did not.  So, how did you find your way to work when you drove here the other day?

I can read a map just fine.  I can find my way by map and compass, and even to some extent by map and stars.  If I wanted to carry all the associated gear, I might even be able to do some fairly accurate celestial navigation.  OTOH, no amount of common sense will make a regional map useful in navigating the idiotic mess that many cities have become; unless you carry a pile of neighborhood maps, you're going to waste a lot of gas backtracking out of dead end neighborhoods, or looking for a one way street that goes the right way.

On 5/6/2018 at 6:43 PM, MormonGator said:

I just came home from a huge road trip. Without a GPS, it would have been incredibly difficult. 

Pretty sure I've done more miles without GPS than with.  Even now, I tend to only use it for the last few miles, once I start needing to get through the sort of messes described above.

On 5/7/2018 at 3:17 AM, JohnsonJones said:

It does allow me to understand those who do NOT bring tablets and other items and even more so when I understand that some of them cannot even afford such things.  That the church expects it of people these days in some areas is kind of a strange new formation of Mormon culture that I do not feel entirely good about.

When I broke the screen of a friend's 3rd gen Kindle, I tracked down a NOS one for $15.  Fire 7s are often available for under $40 shipped.  How many hardcopy books can you buy for $40, compared to the thousands you can fit on even something that outdated by current standards?  

Sure, I personally prefer to have a KJV Bible and a few other books in hardcopy, but realistically, I spend more time reading even those texts on my Fire than the actual paper.

On 5/7/2018 at 9:35 AM, person0 said:

That is hard core!  I hope that I am that hard core should the need arise.  I think I am, we'll see!

They look at me funny for showing up to watch a GC session in bike gear; (mountain shorts, not road Lycra) I can't imagine the reaction if I came to Sacrament Meeting in bunny slippers with morning hair.

[Guest MormonGator]

Just now, NightSG said:

Pretty sure I've done more miles without GPS than with.  Even now, I tend to only use it for the last few miles, once I start needing to get through the sort of messes described above.

 

Oh absolutely. I use it more for timing on the highways than I do for navigation.  Like you though, I use it often when I'm in the cities looking for things. 

[NeuroTypical]

I have an iPhone and use Siri.  My wife has a Samsung and uses whatever abomination AI they use (I think the name is Bixby or something.)

I have Siri set to a male voice, she has Bixby set to a female voice.

Once, we were driving somewhere, and both of us asked our individual phones for directions.  The two AI's went about it in different ways, telling us what to do at different times.  Then came the time when they did not agree on the directions.  One said turn, the other said go straight.  The tension between the two phones was almost palpable.  You could cut it with a knife.  I followed my wife's female-voiced phone's directions, because I am a good husband and did not want to escalate things into a regrettable incident.   To Siri's credit, you had to listen real hard to hear the hurt in his voice as he adjusted his directions after I refused them.  Dude's got my back, and didn't want to make things hard between us.  I think he started offering fewer directions for the rest of that trip too, but perhaps I'm anthropomorphizing a tad.

It was a singular experience.  Like my wife and I had hired someone to do some marital arguing for us.  A bit awkward, but not unpleasant at all. 

Edited May 10, 2018 by NeuroTypical

[anatess2]

16 hours ago, Crypto said:

User Error. The bane of tech support. 😅

Either ID-10-T error or PEBCAK.  Problem exists between chair and keyboard.

[mordorbund]

59 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

I have an iPhone and use Siri.  My wife has a Samsung and uses whatever abomination AI they use (I think the name is Bixby or something.)

I have Siri set to a male voice, she has Bixby set to a female voice.

Once, we were driving somewhere, and both of us asked our individual phones for directions.  The two AI's went about it in different ways, telling us what to do at different times.  Then came the time when they did not agree on the directions.  One said turn, the other said go straight.  The tension between the two phones was almost palpable.  You could cut it with a knife.  I followed my wife's female-voiced phone's directions, because I am a good husband and did not want to escalate things into a regrettable incident.   To Siri's credit, you had to listen real hard to hear the hurt in his voice as he adjusted his directions after I refused them.  Dude's got my back, and didn't want to make things hard between us.  I think he started offering fewer directions for the rest of that trip too, but perhaps I'm anthropomorphizing a tad.

It was a singular experience.  Like my wife and I had hired someone to do some marital arguing for us.  A bit awkward, but not unpleasant at all. 

Somebody call Studio C. I want to watch this!

[NeuroTypical]

57 minutes ago, mordorbund said:

Somebody call Studio C. I want to watch this!

Whoever wishes to turn this thing into a comedy skit or production of some sort, has my blessing - provided they tell me about it and credit me.

[Crypto]

1 hour ago, mordorbund said:

Somebody call Studio C. I want to watch this!

I've seen family members do this very thing. 

[Crypto]

30 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

Whoever wishes to turn this thing into a comedy skit or production of some sort, has my blessing - provided they tell me about it and credit me.

 

2 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

I have an iPhone and use Siri.  My wife has a Samsung and uses whatever abomination AI they use (I think the name is Bixby or something.)

I have Siri set to a male voice, she has Bixby set to a female voice.

Once, we were driving somewhere, and both of us asked our individual phones for directions.  The two AI's went about it in different ways, telling us what to do at different times.  Then came the time when they did not agree on the directions.  One said turn, the other said go straight.  The tension between the two phones was almost palpable.  You could cut it with a knife.  I followed my wife's female-voiced phone's directions, because I am a good husband and did not want to escalate things into a regrettable incident.   To Siri's credit, you had to listen real hard to hear the hurt in his voice as he adjusted his directions after I refused them.  Dude's got my back, and didn't want to make things hard between us.  I think he started offering fewer directions for the rest of that trip too, but perhaps I'm anthropomorphizing a tad.

It was a singular experience.  Like my wife and I had hired someone to do some marital arguing for us.  A bit awkward, but not unpleasant at all. 

I've had family do this very thing, just with the driver not listening to the other GPS....

[JohnsonJones]

On ‎5‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 10:49 AM, NightSG said:

When I broke the screen of a friend's 3rd gen Kindle, I tracked down a NOS one for $15.  Fire 7s are often available for under $40 shipped.  How many hardcopy books can you buy for $40, compared to the thousands you can fit on even something that outdated by current standards?  

Well, a KJV of the Bible...for $15 I can buy 14 of them at the dollar store...or even more at Goodwill (if they have that many, they sell them for 50 cents a copy so around 28 copies).  From the Gideons I can get New Testaments for free.  From the LDS church I can get Book of Mormons for free (though missionaries start giving you weird looks after the third or fourth call in probably, especially if you are a member).

(PS: No, my math isn't THAT off...I'm including that we have to pay sales tax).

[priesthoodpower]

On 5/6/2018 at 5:23 AM, Carborendum said:

Apparently, we seem to be a world dependent upon electronics.  I almost want to be Amish. 

.....

Take away our electronics and we're done for as a nation.

Faith starts where science ends. God is the ultimate scientist and in order for us to become like him we need to advance our science, aka electronics, Its not going to go away, in fact its getting better every decade.

The only thing holding us back is corporations greed for power/money. @vort mentioned petroleum as the life blood of our society, yet the petroleum industry is controlled by powerful men that dont want things to change. It is already a reality that electronics are going to replace the truck driver, maybe iits not too long b4 we get rid of the truck too.

 

 

 

[anatess2]

5 hours ago, priesthoodpower said:

Faith starts where science ends. God is the ultimate scientist and in order for us to become like him we need to advance our science, aka electronics, Its not going to go away, in fact its getting better every decade.

The only thing holding us back is corporations greed for power/money. @vort mentioned petroleum as the life blood of our society, yet the petroleum industry is controlled by powerful men that dont want things to change. It is already a reality that electronics are going to replace the truck driver, maybe iits not too long b4 we get rid of the truck too.

 

 

 

"holding us back - Corporations greed for power/money".

I guess Bill Gates and Steve Jobs did it all because they didn't want power/money.

Newflash - most everything you see around you in the United States of America was built by someone who wanted money.  The guy who made cars did not whine about the guys making horse carriages as "powerful men that didn't want things to change".  They simply out-tech'd them and put them out of business thereby improving efficiency.  That's the indefatigable human nature imprinted into the archetypal heroes of society - they're always looking for better ways to solve human problems... and that includes the energy industry.  General Electric, Siemens, among the big names of energy companies have fossil fuel divisions, solar divisions, wind divisions, hydro divisions... each division creating new and innovative ways of bringing energy to more people in the most efficient manner possible according to the limits of their available resources.  India, for example, cannot afford alternative energy as they try to develop out of 3rd word territory, therefore, GE/Siemens/etc are competing to provide India with the most efficient fossil fuel tech for their money.  That's BIG CORPORATIONS bringing India out of starvation and into western progress. 

But, of course, if you'd rather think of big corporations as evil empires trying to kill the people of India with fossil tech, that's your prerogative.

Edited May 21, 2018 by anatess2

[Guest]

7 hours ago, priesthoodpower said:

Faith starts where science ends. God is the ultimate scientist and in order for us to become like him we need to advance our science, aka electronics, Its not going to go away, in fact its getting better every decade.

The only thing holding us back is corporations greed for power/money. @vort mentioned petroleum as the life blood of our society, yet the petroleum industry is controlled by powerful men that dont want things to change. It is already a reality that electronics are going to replace the truck driver, maybe iits not too long b4 we get rid of the truck too.

[priesthoodpower]

19 hours ago, anatess2 said:

"holding us back - Corporations greed for power/money".

I guess Bill Gates and Steve Jobs did it all because they didn't want power/money. 

Newflash - most everything you see around you in the United States of America was built by someone who wanted money.  The guy who made cars did not whine about the guys making horse carriages as "powerful men that didn't want things to change".  They simply out-tech'd them and put them out of business thereby improving efficiency.  That's the indefatigable human nature imprinted into the archetypal heroes of society - they're always looking for better ways to solve human problems... and that includes the energy industry.  General Electric, Siemens, among the big names of energy companies have fossil fuel divisions, solar divisions, wind divisions, hydro divisions... each division creating new and innovative ways of bringing energy to more people in the most efficient manner possible according to the limits of their available resources.  India, for example, cannot afford alternative energy as they try to develop out of 3rd word territory, therefore, GE/Siemens/etc are competing to provide India with the most efficient fossil fuel tech for their money.  That's BIG CORPORATIONS bringing India out of starvation and into western progress. 

But, of course, if you'd rather think of big corporations as evil empires trying to kill the people of India with fossil tech, that's your prerogative.

Things are changing now because change cannot be stopped anymore, this new younger generation of kids believe in open source and sharing ideas where as the older generation is stuck on patents and monopolizing industrys. Google Monsanto

Once these men build their companys to be big and powerful, they want to keep it that way, even if it means playing dirty politics to shut down the competition that may have a better product/service.

[anatess2]

4 hours ago, priesthoodpower said:

Things are changing now because change cannot be stopped anymore, this new younger generation of kids believe in open source and sharing ideas where as the older generation is stuck on patents and monopolizing industrys. Google Monsanto

Once these men build their companys to be big and powerful, they want to keep it that way, even if it means playing dirty politics to shut down the competition that may have a better product/service.

Ugh.  Monster painting Monsanto again.  I bet you agree with @2ndRateMind that rich people should give away their money to starving people.  Well , guess what,  people like Monsanto are the reason worldwide hunger has been diminishing in the last century.

Dirty politics are the responsibility of dirty politicians.  You can't buy something that is not for sale.

[Guest]

19 hours ago, priesthoodpower said:

Things are changing now because change cannot be stopped anymore

Could it ever?

Quote

this new younger generation of kids believe in open source and sharing ideas where as the older generation is stuck on patents and monopolizing industrys.

And they will never produce anything that will advance society.  You know the old saying,"If you're good at something, never do it for free."

Have you ever looked into the benefits that have been provided because of patents?

Quote

Google Monsanto

And?

Quote

Once these men build their companys to be big and powerful, they want to keep it that way,

How dare they?

Quote

even if it means playing dirty politics to shut down the competition that may have a better product/service.

That never lasts in the long run.  If it is truly a significantly better service, it can't be held down for very long.  I'd like you to provide verfiable facts of an actual big company that has done this to their competition.

Edited May 23, 2018 by Guest

[Overwatch]

On 5/6/2018 at 10:23 AM, Carborendum said:

Apparently, we seem to be a world dependent upon electronics.  I almost want to be Amish. 

My daughter was waiting at work for us to pick her up.  We were quite late because we were stuck in traffic.  She had to go back into the office to ask to borrow the phone to see if we were on our way.  When she did so, they were surprised that she did not have a cell phone.  They let her borrow the landline.

When she got off the phone, a coworker asked her if she at least had a GPS unit in the car.  No.  She did not.  So, how did you find your way to work when you drove here the other day?

Yes.  We're becoming a society so dependent on the internet and electronics that we're forgetting how to do things on our own.  We're forgetting how to think anymore.  We're not aware of our surroundings anymore.

People are beginning to stare at my family when we bring our hard copy scriptures to church.  People at work wonder why I print things out instead of simply working with markup tools on the screen.

Take away our electronics and we're done for as a nation.

I really enjoyed your post.

I think we would be done as a nation because depression would sink in, not because we don't know how to do things. People will always adapt, even when things go south. I myself enjoy electronics and the info I can pull up in just a few seconds.  OH. I just remembered one of the first Mormon messages I heard a while back. I really enjoyed it

(The electronic part reminded me of this for some reason XD)  

I can understand being overwhelmed with it all C :  

Best wishes

[LadyGator]

On 5/7/2018 at 12:52 PM, Carborendum said:

That's why I mentioned my daughter's co-worker.  She was so dependent on a GPS, that she couldn't even fathom how to drive from point A to B without one.  Do you honestly believe that is a good thing?

I am completely dependent on my GPS for work at least the first few times I go to a particular home. I have some homes that I have been going to for about six months that I still have to turn it on towards the end of the trip there because there are so many different roads and dirt roads in the area. I’m sure @MormonGator and my boss are much happier knowing I can get home or back to the office from no matter where I am because I know how to use it. Also hearing the directions is less distracting than trying to read a map and drive. 🙂

[LadyGator]

On 5/7/2018 at 12:52 PM, Carborendum said:

That's why I mentioned my daughter's co-worker.  She was so dependent on a GPS, that she couldn't even fathom how to drive from point A to B without one.  Do you honestly believe that is a good thing?

I am completely dependent on my GPS for work at least the first few times I go to a particular home. I have some homes that I have been going to for about six months that I still have to turn it on towards the end of the trip there because there are so many different roads and dirt roads in the area. I’m sure @MormonGator and my boss are much happier knowing I can get home or back to the office from no matter where I am because I know how to use it. Also hearing the directions is less distracting than trying to read a map and drive. 🙂

Edited May 27, 2018 by LadyGator

[JOSHPAL]

On 5/6/2018 at 6:43 PM, MormonGator said:

I just came home from a huge road trip. Without a GPS, it would have been incredibly difficult. 

I also was able to call LG and text her throughout the weekend. 

And I was able to listen to music/audiobooks in the car. 

And if the car broke down, I could call AAA and not wander aimlessly looking for a pay phone. 

Technology makes our lives much easier. Our ancestors have begged for things like this. 

There is an irony to writing about how much you dislike technology...on the internet. 

EXACTLY

[Guest MormonGator]

10 hours ago, JOSHPAL said:

EXACTLY

Thanks bud. 

[Crypto]

On 5/20/2018 at 9:56 PM, priesthoodpower said:

Faith starts where science ends.

 

I agree with everything except this one little thing. I think they often times coexist. Science is not truth, is not faith....but a very good tool for getting closer to it.

[Guest]

On 5/26/2018 at 9:33 PM, LadyGator said:

I am completely dependent on my GPS for work at least the first few times I go to a particular home. I have some homes that I have been going to for about six months that I still have to turn it on towards the end of the trip there because there are so many different roads and dirt roads in the area. I’m sure @MormonGator and my boss are much happier knowing I can get home or back to the office from no matter where I am because I know how to use it. Also hearing the directions is less distracting than trying to read a map and drive. 🙂

For the continual new road condition you're talking about, I totally understand.  But this coworker that I was mentioning is in the same small town we live in.

This town has one main road where 90% of all businesses are located.   Only three major road crossings.  This place of business is located in a shopping center at one such major intersection.

She was unable to figure out how to get out of her subdivision, to the main road (virtually all these subdivisions empty to a tributary to a main road), down the main road, to the major intersection, and to the store in the shopping center at said intersection.

This is the level of dependence I'm talking about.

I have a GPS.  I use it all the time.  But to think that I couldn't perform the basic navigation described above without it boggles my mind.

[pwrfrk]

A world without electronics?

Sounds....