Would you ever serve alcohol?

[Sunday21]

Would you ever serve alcohol? If you hosted a wedding would you serve alcohol to guests? Would you offer alcohol at a dinner to nonmormon family? Would you buy alcohol for cooking? To take to a party?

I have bought alcohol to take to a party . I bought one with a cartoon cat on the label Called "cat's piss". I have bought alcohol for relatives coming to stay for a week at Xmas. I am not sure that I would any of things today.

What are your views?

[Guest]

I pitched in to buy a bottle of nice wine for a boss who had everything. I've sold beer at a concert venue for a fundraiser. 

 

I wouldn't serve it in my home. If a person can't go an evening without alcohol, that's a problem. I have cooked with it, but I've never bought it. Mostly I don't really know how to cook with it much, and wouldn't even know what to buy. I'm okay with substitutes. I grow concords and have canned some wonderful grape juice. :)

Edited October 31, 2015 by Eowyn

[Ironhold]

There are actually liability issues now if people serve alcohol at events.

If someone gets into a traffic accident or has a medical issue related in any fashion to alcohol, then the person who served them can be held legally liable for serving them.

[Jane_Doe]

If it's a personal event that I'm in charge of, no I don't serve it. 

 

If it's someone else's event and I'm just helping out, sure out of respect for them (example, helping out at a wedding where the host has brought alcohol).  

 

I have purchased alcohol, when it's a work event and my boss tells me to buy XYZ with company funds. 

[Bini]

I've purchased smokes and alcohol for clients. I've never sold either but have also bought for friends, and nicer alcoholic beverages for special occasions.

We do not keep alcohol in our household and I won't be pressured into serving anything we don't keep in stock. If I'm hosting an event for a friend, I'm likely to make exceptions, especially if outside of my home. But I do not allow smoking at all on our property, inside our out on our deck, I don't want it around my family - and I used to smoke.

[Backroads]

We've bought it for cooking.

I'm not opposed to the idea of buying it for a loved one as a thoughtful gift, but I doubt I'd stock it in my home in case someone wanting alcohol dropped by.

Is it considered being a good host in some circles to keep alcohol if you don't personally drink it?

[Guest Godless]

Why yes, yes I would.

Edited October 31, 2015 by Godless

[Palerider]

I wouldn't buy it or serve it .....3 years ago my youngest daughter married a man not a member. He is a good guy and I am glad to have him as a son in law. His Grandmother insisted on having alcohol at reception. Finally , I told my daughter that under no circumstances would I pay for a reception where alcohol is served. My daughter told me his Grandmother was going to pay for the reception.

[Crypto]

Maybe to cook with depending on the dish.

Likely no other circumstance unless it was part of employment, like at a restaurant. Since other people aren't under covenant to not drink I don't really have a problem with other people using it, if they want it they are free to opt to get it themselves.

[Vort]

No, I would not buy alcohol for consumption or as a gift. I once received a bottle of vodka as a software shipping party gift. I think I eventually gave it to someone, but now I wish I'd kept it and made vanilla extract from it. Sister Vort does occasional cooking with rice or grape wine, but it's always unusual. I recently had to pry a cork out of a wine bottle because -- surprise! -- we don't have a corkscrew.

[Capitalist_Oinker]

Would you ever serve alcohol? If you hosted a wedding would you serve alcohol to guests? Would you offer alcohol at a dinner to nonmormon family? Would you buy alcohol for cooking? To take to a party?

 

No, no, no, no, and no.

[Guest]

I don't know why this is an issue.  There is nothing inherently sinful about drinking alcohol from time to time.  We as Saints don't drink it because it is part of a covenant.  It is wrong for US to drink it because of that covenant.

 

Others have not made that covenant; thus they commit no sin.  Therefore, to serve it to them is no sin either.  It is probably unwise and possibly a sin to drink until you're slobbering drunk.  But this is different than it is for us.

 

I'd still want to obey certain rules such as refusing to serve to someone who is already clearly wasted.

[Guest MormonGator]

Yes, I do all the time. I'm not going to ask my friends to live by my rules. And my friends don't expect me to drink it ether. How dare I ask them to subscribe to morals they don't believe in! That would damage our friendship and like all of us, I love my nonmember friends! 

 

Yes, I buy wine all the time for my good friends. My family collects and adores it. I also keep an unopened bottle of champagne to celebrate milestones. 

 

I bought a bottle of scotch as a gift to contractors who worked on my house. 

 

I also bought some cigars a few weeks ago for a friend's bachelor party. They smoked it out on my deck. I was right there chatting and having a blast, but I was drinking a coke and not smoking. 

Edited November 1, 2015 by MormonGator

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

For the most part I agree with Carbendum and Mormon Gator.

 

Personally though I don't serve alcohol because I come from a family of alcoholics.  Having lived with the effects of excess alcohol, I prefer to stay away from it now.  

[The Folk Prophet]

I don't know why this is an issue. There is nothing inherently sinful about drinking alcohol from time to time. We as Saints don't drink it because it is part of a covenant. It is wrong for US to drink it because of that covenant.

Others have not made that covenant; thus they commit no sin. Therefore, to serve it to them is no sin either. It is probably unwise and possibly a sin to drink until you're slobbering drunk. But this is different than it is for us.

I'd still want to obey certain rules such as refusing to serve to someone who is already clearly wasted.

I think this sort of misses the point. Anything done without knowledge is not sinful. Setting a standard and living by it serves a variety of purposes, not the least of which is the message sent.

[beefche]

I hate alcohol. I don't come from an alcoholic family, but I see the results of alcohol in the news and in individuals. I've made covenants to not drink it, so I don't drink it nor will I serve it (unless I have a job like waitressing, where I would be required). I recognize that others are not under the same covenants. But, because of my hatred for it, I don't want to support the industry, so I refuse to cook with it or eat anything that I know has alcohol in it.

 

I don't require anyone to not drink it in front of me (in fact, I'll be having "drinks" with some cow-orkers this week), but once they begin to get buzzed or drunk, then I leave. I hate how it changes it people. And I will never understand why people celebrate it as they do. All you have to do is watch any show, comedian, anything and see what happens if they say the word, "beer" or "alcohol". The people cheer and go wild. 

[kapikui]

No, I would not buy alcohol for consumption or as a gift. I once received a bottle of vodka as a software shipping party gift. I think I eventually gave it to someone, but now I wish I'd kept it and made vanilla extract from it. Sister Vort does occasional cooking with rice or grape wine, but it's always unusual. I recently had to pry a cork out of a wine bottle because -- surprise! -- we don't have a corkscrew.

Not even on an old Swiss Army Knife?

[Traveler]

Early in my life I made an effort to be social with others that do not have my same word of wisdom covenants – thinking I could perhaps be a positive influence. I discovered that an initial effect of alcohol is judgment and reason and I also discovered that I have a prejudice of not liking idiots – in fact I really do not like even trying to help an idiot and alcohol will change a genius into an idiot. But a lot of people that drink are not geniuses.

I would not consider serving alcohol (or even a job that required serving it) or when I am given alcohol I will not re-gift; it will be disposed of. I will sometimes attend events where alcohol is served right up to when it is served, than I leave. I will not even be a designated driver. Been there done that. I no longer attend meetings at bars. If someone would rather drink than have me around – I understand and I am not going to argue any point or in any way make a scene or force my standards on others. If necessary I will lie to avoid any conformation with someone that wants alcohol. But I am at a place in life that I will no longer deal with it – period and I have, for the most part, ran out of sympathy for those that allow any influence into their life, directly or indirectly related to alcohol consumption.

[prisonchaplain]

For LDS, the WoW is obedience to modern prophecy.  Abstaining from alcohol is part of that. 

 

My church affirms abstinence from alcohol, for both social and biblical reasons.  It is death.  It cost a loved one 19 years.  He died of end stage liver disease at 68.  His father quite drinking in his 40s, and lived to be 87.  In my church, nearly every family has a story of how alcohol was a major contributor to some kind of trauma.  In the jail, I had one individual who was in for a particularly disgusting crime admit to me that he would always get very drunk, to work up the nerve to do his sin.

 

I have no condemnation for any responses here. I affirm your church's stance, and would encourage fanatical obedience to this particular command.  You do yourself, your family, and your community a huge blessing when you do.

[Vort]

I think this sort of misses the point. Anything done without knowledge is not sinful. Setting a standard and living by it serves a variety of purposes, not the least of which is the message sent.

 

True, but some acts are inherently damaging. For example, killing another human being changes your spirit, so it must never be done except in extreme circumstances. Even primitive tribal peoples who engage in ritual warfare and other such murders are spiritually mutilated by the act, though they don't know it's immoral. Another example: Sex changes who you are, so fornication is a damaging act -- whether or not you are under covenant, and whether or not you even realize it.

 

Drug usage is always suspect, and alcohol has been recognized for thousands of years as a curse on humanity, or at least as a mixed blessing. But alcohol is a food product present in many things we eat and drink, albeit in small quantities. I do not believe there is anything intrinsically spiritually damaging about drinking some wine. If there is, then it is mighty strange that Jesus Christ himself would drink wine. I have never drunk wine (or other alcoholic beverages) in my life, and expect never to do so -- but I hope to drink wine with my Savior at his coming.

[Vort]

Not even on an old Swiss Army Knife?

 

Nope. Shameful, I know. I ended up using a couple of forks, which worked well.

[Guest]

I had the same problem once.  Someone thought it would be fun to have a bottle of non-alcoholic wine for our family.  We spent probably 20 minutes trying to figure out a way to get the cork out.

[beefche]

 

 

Drug usage is always suspect, and alcohol has been recognized for thousands of years as a curse on humanity, or at least as a mixed blessing. But alcohol is a food product present in many things we eat and drink, albeit in small quantities. I do not believe there is anything intrinsically spiritually damaging about drinking some wine. If there is, then it is mighty strange that Jesus Christ himself would drink wine. I have never drunk wine (or other alcoholic beverages) in my life, and expect never to do so -- but I hope to drink wine with my Savior at his coming.

 

 

I agree with you that drinking wine isn't bad in and of itself. From my observations, most people just can't seem to stop at one glass of wine. Perhaps on occasion they stop, but more often than not, they drink more than one glass or more than one beer, etc. Even at professional settings, it amazes me that people don't exert self-control and get buzzed/drunk and act like idiots.

[The Folk Prophet]

True, but some acts are inherently damaging. For example, killing another human being changes your spirit, so it must never be done except in extreme circumstances. Even primitive tribal peoples who engage in ritual warfare and other such murders are spiritually mutilated by the act, though they don't know it's immoral. Another example: Sex changes who you are, so fornication is a damaging act -- whether or not you are under covenant, and whether or not you even realize it.

Drug usage is always suspect, and alcohol has been recognized for thousands of years as a curse on humanity, or at least as a mixed blessing. But alcohol is a food product present in many things we eat and drink, albeit in small quantities. I do not believe there is anything intrinsically spiritually damaging about drinking some wine. If there is, then it is mighty strange that Jesus Christ himself would drink wine. I have never drunk wine (or other alcoholic beverages) in my life, and expect never to do so -- but I hope to drink wine with my Savior at his coming.

Sure. But there is, potentially something, arguably, spiritually damaging about serving, giving, or buying alcohol when the usage of it is against covenants made.

[Ironhold]

For LDS, the WoW is obedience to modern prophecy.  Abstaining from alcohol is part of that. 

 

My church affirms abstinence from alcohol, for both social and biblical reasons.  It is death.

I work for the Copperas Cove Leader-Press newspaper. I started out as a courier, then branched out to perform other duties.

On April 26, 2013, I was in the office waiting for the newspapers to arrive. I made it a point to arrive 30 - 60 minutes early most mornings so that I could get the office prepped and ready; this way, everything was done so that we could get straight to work once the papers arrived.

At about 2:45 AM, I was just finishing up. The last thing for me to do was to wheel the metal furniture dolly / cart to the front of the building so that we could use it to unload the papers. I brought it up, turned my back to the door, and went to sit down when I heard a horrific noise.

This is what I saw.

I appear to have misplaced my copy of the newspaper that had the final coroner's report. But what happened is painfully clear. A young man in his early 20s had consumed an astounding quantity of alcohol, marijuana, and Xanax. For reasons unknown, he felt himself well enough to drive. He was doing about 80 or so and going westbound on US Highway 190 (now known as Business 190 in that stretch) when he lost control and crossed the line of traffic. He was going so fast that he jumped a creek that serves as the property line between my building and that building, bounced off the far bank of the creek, rolled onto his right side, and went through the front of a wooden office structure. The young man was killed instantly. I showed the copy to a member of my parents' ward, a retired US Army medic. He explained that given the quantities which showed up, the young man may not have even been awake when he died; if he was, he didn't feel anything despite how violent his death was.

Fortunately, the storefront he hit an insurance company's branch office. At the other side of the building, on ground level, was a hair salon loaded with plenty of flammable and explosive products. (See the red sign in the video? That was the shop.)

When I went outside, there was a small fire in the engine block; I could see it from the other side of the creek. I called 911, cradling my cell phone to my ear while I went for one of the office's fire extinguishers. I jogged over as fast as I could (I have a lot of old injures that slow me up), at which point I met with residents of the apartment complex on the other side of the highway. I handed them the extinguisher so I could continue my call, but none of them knew how to use it. I was about to go handle the fire myself when a police officer showed up. He took the extinguisher, told us all to clear out, and started smashing windows on the car to check on the driver.

Just after I made it back to the newspaper office's parking lot, I heard a "Whoosh!" sound and looked back around. The engine had gone up, and so now the entire front of the building was on fire. All I could do was call the guy who was our head editor at the time and get him down to the office.

I called my parents to let them know I was fine, and then alerted the other couriers since they hadn't arrived yet. I finished my route, came home, and spent the next half hour looping "Honoo No Overdrive" (the theme from Transformers: Car Robots) so that the world felt right again.

Eleven months later...

We'd switched to having the papers arrive in the late afternoon / early evening. My job at the time was to prepare the newspapers that would go out by mail. This meant simply applying the mailing labels, getting the bundles together, tying them with twine, and getting them in the mail bags. It didn't take very long, and this night I was done early. Given that I had time to spare, I figured that I'd detour on the way home and visit a friend of mine; there were good odds he'd still be up and I hadn't seen him in a while.

Along the way I spotted a silver Corvette parked in the middle of the street, the driver talking with the driver of a vehicle that was off to the side of the road. My first instinct was to pull over and see if they were all right, but a voice told me "Keep going; it'll be fine."

So I did.

I get a block or two down the road and I hear the same horrific sound coming from behind me. I see a cloud of dust in my rear-view mirror and so I do a u-turn.

The two vehicles were parked just before the crest of a small hill. Because of this, an oncoming SUV - one that had just passed me - hadn't seen them since we were on the other side of the crest. The driver plowed into the Corvette at such a high rate of speed that she totaled it, almost completely caving the front end in. The Corvette slammed into the other car, seriously damaging it. The other car slammed into - and sheered off - a brick mailbox. The car had also knocked over a resident of the house they were parked in front of. Once again, I called 911.

I was still talking to dispatch when I parked my car and got out to investigate. The occupants of the various vehicles were out and trying to collect themselves. I wound up helping the kid who had been knocked down - guy couldn't have been more than his late teens - try to collect himself. He was in shock from what happened, but he had enough sense left to realize that he was in shock and so he tried to fight it. He actually had the presence of mind to ask a female relative to get his music player, only to realize that [1] it was already in his pocket and [2] he had forgotten to recharge it.

I helped the kid onto the stretcher when the ambulance arrived. His ankle & foot had been injured, but the paramedics were optimistic that he'd be just fine in time. With them gone, I had a chance to assess the situation. As part of it, I heard the SUV driver admit that she'd been drinking, at which point the police officer questioning her told her that she was going to jail.

About this time, one of the neighbors came up to investigate. The minute he saw the Corvette, he freaked out. It turns out that he was the dealer who had sold the Corvette to its owner just a few days ago, and so he knew the people who were involved.

Specifically, the guy who owned the car and his 10-year-old son. The father had, like me, decided to stop and visit some friends (the people in the other car, who lived at the house we were in front of) on his way home. When the guy realized what happened, he threw his arm in front of his son to shield him. The boy survived unscathed, while the guy had cuts to his legs. With the Corvette obviously totaled, the dealer offered to drive them home.

Before they left, however, the dealer and I got to talking. When I told him that, from the looks of it, everyone had survived despite how horrific the scene looked, all he could say was "Praise the Lord."