Guest Scott Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) Quote Many people throughout history, including today, see nothing immodest about a woman exposing her breast to feed her child. This is true even in our Church outside the US. In the US it seems to be a "problem", but when we went to Church in South and Central America, it was common for women to breastfeed without blankets in meetings including Sacrament. No one there seems to give it a second thought. Few people there seem to use bottles either. Edited July 31, 2018 by Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeedleinA Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 31 minutes ago, pwrfrk said: But a baby needs fed. Reflecting on my experiences as a non-practicing naturist, I am compelled to say that if you what to breastfeed at church, use a $20 cover up blanket and knock yourself out. You must have glossed over that point. Next time I'll have to spell it out more clearly, oh wait: 2 hours ago, NeedleinA said: A $20 cover up blanket or a $40 obscure maternity bra and NeedleinA has zero problems. Can't afford a $20 blanket? Use an extra shirt? Don't have an extra shirt? Use 10 socks weaved together. 31 minutes ago, pwrfrk said: You're not the only person there. This is exactly my thought about the person who feels the 'desire' to unnecessarily expose themselves in church, "You're not the only person there". Would you extend to me the same naturist courtesy if I showed up and sat on the pew next to you after an all night Taco Bell binge and passed gas during Sacrament meeting for 30 minutes straight each week? Don't like the noise, not my problem, "Plug your ears". Don't like the smell, not my problem, "Close you nose". If it is "really" a problem the Bishop will address it. After all: Quote I see no reason for people to be offended over a purly natural event. unixknight 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwrfrk Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 6 minutes ago, NeedleinA said: Reflecting on my experiences as a non-practicing naturist.... - snip - Needle, it sounds to me like you have a problem that I cannot help you with. Backroads 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeedleinA Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) 33 minutes ago, pwrfrk said: Needle, it sounds to me like you have a problem that I cannot help you with. If reversing your own logic points against you means I have a problem you can't help me with, I suppose, "ditto right back at you then". While I can tell neither of us may become breastfeeding buddies anytime soon, as a member of the Church, I wish you the best all the same. Edited July 31, 2018 by NeedleinA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeedleinA Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 On 7/30/2018 at 11:40 PM, pwrfrk said: removing links to nudist colonies Sorry, but... ...where once I thought we might be able to nudge each either to some kind of LDS (The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) centered common ground, if these are the Non-LDS links you are attempting to provide as your supporting evidence, we are not even on the same planet of Church taught/promoted/endorsed thought or "common sense". Please provide any link from an official Church source that teaches I should pack up my family and go hang out with them and other strangers in the nude. FHE manual lesson, Seminary lesson, Conference talk, Gospel Doctrine lesson, Come Follow Me lesson... any single link? Innocent nakedness was what Adam and Eve participated in 'before' the fall. Their nakedness was covered by God 'after' the fall, the world in which we now live for a reason, a reason above and beyond just a physical protection from the elements. Covering our nakedness isn't just for the benefit of that person alone, it is also to help others as we try to navigate and fight off the temptations of the natural man in this fallen world. If you need a refresher on some of this - I invite you to attend the temple and participate in an endowment session. As an endowed member, participating in some kind of nudist gathering by myself or with my family is not in harmony with: Quote Endowed members should wear the temple garment both day and night. They should not remove it, either entirely or partially, to work in the yard or for other activities that can reasonably be done with the garment worn properly beneath the clothing. Again, we are so far off from one another I'm not sure we even attend the same LDS church, read the same Church material or listen to the same prophet. pwrfrk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 10 hours ago, NeuroTypical said: Now I'm pretty much down with 99% of everything I hear from MormonGator. You're ok in my book. We just can't agree on everything. Thanks bud. I know it isn't personal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anatess2 Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) I didn't read all the responses because I find the conversation idiotic. I breastfed two boys. LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE TO DO WITH YOUR CHILDREN, breastfeeding is something you LEARN TO DO. The ideal, traditional way is that women learn these things from their mothers. I don't know what you guys's mothers where teaching you, growing up in American culture and all, but you don't need no "cover ups" or going to "mother's rooms" or any of that craziness. I breastfed my 5 week old baby in the middle of the crowd in a football stadium. I didn't flash breasts, I didn't bother anybody, not even the beer-guzzling behemoth of a man next to me. The baby's face was exposed, my breasts weren't. It's not rocket science. Being a "frazzled mother" is NO EXCUSE to just do whatever you want to do because you're too frazzled to learn to do it properly within the confines of your society. Yeah, sorry kiddo, I was too frazzled to learn how to change your nappies properly so rashes/smashes/deal with it... or that poopy nappy is going on the sidewalk because I'm too frazzled to throw it properly. IT COMES WITH HAVING A BABY. So, this is not an issue of how to do it - because doing it modestly is super easy. THIS IS AN ISSUE OF MILITANT WOMEN WANTING YOU TO CHANGE YOUR ATTITUDE so they can be free to do ANYTHING without consequence... because, muh patriarchy. It's a political statement. So yeah, go to China and flash your breasts in public to feed your baby and tell the cop putting you in communist jail - this is a natural thing and you should just avert your eyes you creep! Edited July 31, 2018 by anatess2 zil, Midwest LDS, Backroads and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anatess2 Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) And THIS IS FOR YOU, MEN, who think mothers should go find a private room to feed their babies. If you're gonna eat on the McDonald's tables and chairs, babies can eat there too. Get yourself educated on breastfeeding as well so you don't subject your wife to unnecessary rules. And please bring the Chinese. Edited July 31, 2018 by anatess2 Midwest LDS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 1 hour ago, anatess2 said: ...I breastfed my 5 week old baby in the middle of the crowd in a football stadium.... ...So, this is not an issue of how to do it - because doing it modestly is super easy. THIS IS AN ISSUE OF MILITANT WOMEN WANTING YOU TO CHANGE YOUR ATTITUDE so they can be free to do ANYTHING without consequence... because, muh patriarchy. It's a political statement.... This statement of yours is crap. This has nothing to do with, as riduculous as it sounds, militant women. How ludicrous! Breastfeeding is about feeding and soothing a baby. Even if a woman breastfeeds not to your standards @anatess2, that woman is not part of some ridiculous conspiracy; her main goal is feeding her baby. It's that simple. M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anatess2 Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 2 minutes ago, Maureen said: This statement of yours is crap. This has nothing to do with, as riduculous as it sounds, militant women. How ludicrous! Breastfeeding is about feeding and soothing a baby. Even if a woman breastfeeds not to your standards @anatess2, that woman is not part of some ridiculous conspiracy; her main goal is feeding her baby. It's that simple. M. Oh hi there militant woman. Midwest LDS, zil, pwrfrk and 1 other 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omegaseamaster75 Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 16 hours ago, Vort said: What is wrong with being "puritanical"? Nothing is wrong with it, until it clouds our judgement. Breastfeeding is a great example. I agree with our leaders that there needs to be a level of modesty surrounding what we do and how we behave and dress. I also think that there are some situations where the rules surrounding modesty need to be adjusted Breastfeeding is one of them. Backroads 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omegaseamaster75 Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 13 hours ago, NeedleinA said: Does breastfeeding your baby with an exposed breast in sacrament meeting constitute some kind of special occasion where our council regarding modesty is placed on pause or temporarily suspended? Depending on the situation yes. You quoted Dallin H Oaks 13 hours ago, NeedleinA said: And young women, please understand that if you dress immodestly, you are magnifying this problem by becoming pornography to some of the men who see you. I have big problems with his statement, but I don't view it as relevant to this discussion. I will say this, Breastfeeding is not sexual. I read your little diatribe about how it is in the world of porn etc. etc. If our youth, husbands, and other men are having sexual thoughts when they see a woman breast feeding they should have a discussion with their bishop, at a minimum take a hard look in the mirror and get a grip on reality. Backroads and Maureen 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 6 minutes ago, omegaseamaster75 said: If our youth, husbands, and other men are having sexual thoughts when they see a woman breast feeding they should have a discussion with their bishop, at a minimum take a hard look in the mirror and get a grip on reality. My thoughts completely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unixknight Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 18 minutes ago, omegaseamaster75 said: Depending on the situation yes. You quoted Dallin H Oaks I have big problems with his statement, but I don't view it as relevant to this discussion. I will say this, Breastfeeding is not sexual. I read your little diatribe about how it is in the world of porn etc. etc. If our youth, husbands, and other men are having sexual thoughts when they see a woman breast feeding they should have a discussion with their bishop, at a minimum take a hard look in the mirror and get a grip on reality. Breastfeeding isn't sexual, true. But c'mon... wherever one might stand on this issue, can we at least agree that a 15-year-old boy ain't looking at the baby... Midwest LDS, Just_A_Guy and NeedleinA 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omegaseamaster75 Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 6 minutes ago, unixknight said: Breastfeeding isn't sexual, true. But c'mon... wherever one might stand on this issue, can we at least agree that a 15-year-old boy ain't looking at the baby... I agree, and this becomes a teaching moment for the parents. Backroads and unixknight 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 28 minutes ago, unixknight said: Breastfeeding isn't sexual, true. But c'mon... wherever one might stand on this issue, can we at least agree that a 15-year-old boy ain't looking at the baby... When my oldest was 15, he observed his mother nursing his baby brother on a daily basis, several times per day. I honestly do not know what effect this had on him or on his other siblings. Perhaps it was bad, raising in his mind all sorts of sexual questions and feelings that he didn't know how to deal with. But I rather suspect its effect was to model for him what a woman's breasts were actually created for. Again, I do not know this, but I suppose that catching the occasional glimpse of his mother's naked breast did not raise feelings of lust or sexual desire in him. I like to think that it gave him a healthy perspective on the meanings and consequences of sex and the reason God gave us certain physical features. There is nothing wrong with breasts being used in sexual enjoyment, just as there is nothing wrong with getting a foot rub. But breasts do not exist for sexual pleasure, any more than feet exist so that they can be massaged. Midwest LDS, MrShorty, Sunday21 and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unixknight Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 6 minutes ago, Vort said: When my oldest was 15, he observed his mother nursing his baby brother on a daily basis, several times per day. I honestly do not know what effect this had on him or on his other siblings. Perhaps it was bad, raising in his mind all sorts of sexual questions and feelings that he didn't know how to deal with. But I rather suspect its effect was to model for him what a woman's breasts were actually created for. Again, I do not know this, but I suppose that catching the occasional glimpse of his mother's naked breast did not raise feelings of lust or sexual desire in him. I like to think that it gave him a healthy perspective on the meanings and consequences of sex and the reason God gave us certain physical features. There is nothing wrong with breasts being used in sexual enjoyment, just as there is nothing wrong with getting a foot rub. But breasts do not exist for sexual pleasure, any more than feet exist so that they can be massaged. I would speculate that when it's mom, there's nothing noteworthy about it... but somebody else, I think., would be a different matter. But again, I'm speculating. I never had younger siblings so I don't know what that's like... For that last part, I differ slightly in that I would say they're for both. A lot of women are aroused by the stimulation and that ain't cultural. SilentOne 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroTypical Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 Not everyone can manage to yell at both sides of an issue and be correct, but I think Anatess is making it work here... unixknight, Midwest LDS, Just_A_Guy and 1 other 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeedleinA Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 1 hour ago, omegaseamaster75 said: You quoted Dallin H Oaks I have big problems with his statement, Obviously your choice to have big problems with his statement or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 2 hours ago, Maureen said: This statement of yours is crap. This has nothing to do with, as riduculous as it sounds, militant women. How ludicrous! Breastfeeding is about feeding and soothing a baby. Even if a woman breastfeeds not to your standards @anatess2, that woman is not part of some ridiculous conspiracy; her main goal is feeding her baby. It's that simple. M. That is a false statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 2 hours ago, MormonGator said: My thoughts completely The same could be said about a spouse that exposes her breasts in public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 3 minutes ago, Grunt said: The same could be said about a spouse that exposes her breasts in public. I have a very European view of sexuality. If that's what a spouse wants to do, go for it. It's her body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grunt Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 Just now, MormonGator said: I have a very European view of sexuality. If that's what a spouse wants to do, go for it. It's her body. Sure. However, a "European View" of sexuality is typically inconsistent with the teachings of Prophets. Vort and NeedleinA 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 5 minutes ago, Grunt said: Sure. However, a "European View" of sexuality is typically inconsistent with the teachings of Prophets. Well. It's out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeedleinA Posted July 31, 2018 Report Share Posted July 31, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, omegaseamaster75 said: I agree, and this becomes a teaching moment for the parents. Because most youth are so quick to bring things like this up to their parents. "Hey dad I noticed Sister X's nude breasts at Church, is there a teaching moment you have for me now?" Edited July 31, 2018 by NeedleinA zil 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.