Results of the Flood

[Emmanuel Goldstein]

Is it possible that carbon dating is way off and that dinosaurs may have been the giants spoken of in the Book of Moses?

Moses 7:15 And the giants of the land, also, stood afar off

Moses 8:18 And in those days there were giants on the earth, and they sought Noah to take away his life; but the Lord was with Noah, and the power of the Lord was upon him. 

[MrShorty]

The creationists among would say that it is not only possible, but probable that radiometric dating is completely bogus. There is a report out there that Dr. Henry Eyring once sat down with Joseph Fielding Smith to discuss these issues, and he (a chemist) could not convince Elder Smith (a fairly staunch young earth creationist) that radiometric dating had any validity. They apparently agreed to disagree and went on their separate ways.

Those of us who have been blinded by modern science would probably say something like radiometric data does have uncertainty in it (like any measurement method), but there is not enough uncertainty to have dinosaurs and hominids co-existing on the planet at the same time (except for those who want to be pedantic and remind us that birds could technically be classified as dinosaurs and, obviously, we co-exist with birds even today).

From there, the long and painful and never ending debate between creationist and evolutionist continues with no resolution or reconciliation in sight.

[Grunt]

And we're off!

[Vort]

I find the religionists vs evolutionists arguments particularly frustrating, because I consider myself a religionist first, but recognize that the evolutionists have by far the stronger arguments. And when I say by far, I mean BY FAR. It's not even close. The anti-evolutionary religionists usually come off as mouthy children, unwilling and perhaps unable to comprehend the adults in the room. Very frustrating -- and unnecessary. The gospel does not teach or dispel scientific models, except perhaps in rare cases where science attempts to model morality.

[Grunt]

21 minutes ago, Vort said:

I find the religionists vs evolutionists arguments particularly frustrating, because I consider myself a religionist first, but recognize that the evolutionists have by far the stronger arguments. And when I say by far, I mean BY FAR. It's not even close. The anti-evolutionary religionists usually come off as mouthy children, unwilling and perhaps unable to comprehend the adults in the room. Very frustrating -- and unnecessary. The gospel does not teach or dispel scientific models, except perhaps in rare cases where science attempts to model morality.

 

This.  Yet there will still be 24 pages arguing about it.

[zil]

59 minutes ago, Emmanuel Goldstein said:

Is it possible that carbon dating is way off and that dinosaurs may have been the giants spoken of in the Book of Moses?

...

Moses 8:18 And in those days there were giants on the earth, and they sought Noah to take away his life; but the Lord was with Noah, and the power of the Lord was upon him.

So these giant dinosaurs were malicious, recognized specific individuals, and wanted to kill them?  Maybe dinosaurs were particularly susceptible to possession by evil spirits.

It's fine by me if people want to question the validity of carbon dating and what-not, but let's not go to absurd extremes to do it.  (Of course, this would give us a nice easy explanation for why Noah didn't make the ark big enough to hold dinosaurs - the meanies were after him!)

[Anddenex]

24 minutes ago, Grunt said:

This.  Yet there will still be 24 pages arguing about it.

I will make sure I am apart of those arguments!

[MarginOfError]

My understanding of carbon dating is that the calculation of age based on the amount of C14 remaining in an on organic substance is pretty error proof.  

What isn't so error proof is estimating the amount of C12 that existed in the atmosphere at any given point in history. And the C12 is an important reference in performing the carbon dating analysis. 

That being said, carbon dating is believed to be accurate to within about 80 years for objects as old as 50,000 - 75,000 years.  If Noah is supposed to have lived about 5,000 years ago, carbon dating could reliably separate the older fossils of dinosaurs from Noah's lifetime. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiocarbon_dating)

Summary: Yes, carbon dating can be wickedly inaccurate for very old samples.  But 5,000 years isn't very old, and is recent enough to rule out dinosaurs coexisting with recorded human history.

 

[zil]

https://www.lds.org/scriptures/bd/giants?lang=eng

[zil]

Just in case I don't get a chance to make new off-topic doodles:

 

[Anddenex]

1 hour ago, Emmanuel Goldstein said:

Is it possible that carbon dating is way off and that dinosaurs may have been the giants spoken of in the Book of Moses?

Moses 7:15 And the giants of the land, also, stood afar off

Moses 8:18 And in those days there were giants on the earth, and they sought Noah to take away his life; but the Lord was with Noah, and the power of the Lord was upon him. 

I think it is important to note the giants spoken of are not dinosaurs. They were humans (very tall humans - I wouldn't be surprised if these were what we call now Neanderthals), by which I believe Goliath was mentioned to be a descendant of (if I am remembering correctly).

Although, I may not see eye to eye with @Vort, @MrShorty, and others -- I do not consider myself one of the children spoken of (although they may say otherwise )

Most creationists I speak with do not believe radioactive dating as completely bogus, they just don't see it as absolute without error. I would agree with this sentiment with regards to carbon dating. Let me provide an example of carbon dating my friend shares with me when he was a student at the University of Utah (Yes, I know, he has a handicap already but bear with his story anyway). They created a fossil in their lab through machines. In order to test carbon dating they took the fossil to the research department who then carbon dated the fossil to be thousands of years old. It was created within that same week.

Then any creationist would ask, "How accurate then is carbon dating"? This should be asked by anyone seeking after truth.

Second question, if God is able to extend a day, would carbon dating recognize the extended day (or extended period) as one day or multiple days?

We have other examples of carbon dating (at least from what I read previously) where it dates the same animal parts differently. I am open to any new findings on these, but the ones I read are always from the extreme opposite, which of course is going to provide something different.

EDIT - I would be more interested in the term "beasts" used in scriptures. It has been said by some that the dinosaurs were part of the "beasts" in scripture.

Edited August 14, 2018 by Anddenex

[Rob Osborn]

Yes, carbon dating is off, not correct. Did dinosaurs and man coexist? Absolutely. The evidence is overwhelming. Someday science will have to humble themselves and accept these facts.

[zil]

Visconti Sepia in Platinum 3776 Century, F (Noah & ark; also the woman dating carbon in next post)

Sailor Sei-Boku in Pilot Stargazer, F (triceratops)

Waterman Mysterious Blue in Waterman Laureat, F (Brontey; also carbon in next post)

Akkerman #09 Laan van Nieuw Oost-Indigo in Pilot Vanishing Point, F (Kangasaurus Hex)

Edited August 14, 2018 by zil
Added pen and ink info

[zil]

[Emmanuel Goldstein]

24 minutes ago, zil said:

Visconti Sepia in Platinum 3776 Century, F (Noah & ark; also the woman dating carbon in next post)

Sailor Sei-Boku in Pilot Stargazer, F (triceratops)

Waterman Mysterious Blue in Waterman Laureat, F (Brontey; also carbon in next post)

Akkerman #09 Laan van Nieuw Oost-Indigo in Pilot Vanishing Point, F (Kangasaurus Hex)

You forgot to add the 'powder' of the Lord on Noah. 

[jerome1232]

1 hour ago, zil said:

Visconti Sepia in Platinum 3776 Century, F (Noah & ark; also the woman dating carbon in next post)

Sailor Sei-Boku in Pilot Stargazer, F (triceratops)

Waterman Mysterious Blue in Waterman Laureat, F (Brontey; also carbon in next post)

Akkerman #09 Laan van Nieuw Oost-Indigo in Pilot Vanishing Point, F (Kangasaurus Hex)

Oh my, I'm hoping this will be a weekly comic!

[askandanswer]

Yearly would be even better  

[askandanswer]

2 hours ago, zil said:

Visconti Sepia in Platinum 3776 Century, F (Noah & ark; also the woman dating carbon in next post)

Sailor Sei-Boku in Pilot Stargazer, F (triceratops)

Waterman Mysterious Blue in Waterman Laureat, F (Brontey; also carbon in next post)

Akkerman #09 Laan van Nieuw Oost-Indigo in Pilot Vanishing Point, F (Kangasaurus Hex)

You make it sound as if you have more than one pen? Or maybe one pen with multiple names? I'm not sure why anyone would go to such extremes.

Edited August 14, 2018 by askandanswer

[zil]

3 minutes ago, askandanswer said:

You make it sound as if you have more than one pen?

[Fether]

2 hours ago, zil said:

Visconti Sepia in Platinum 3776 Century, F (Noah & ark; also the woman dating carbon in next post)

Sailor Sei-Boku in Pilot Stargazer, F (triceratops)

Waterman Mysterious Blue in Waterman Laureat, F (Brontey; also carbon in next post)

Akkerman #09 Laan van Nieuw Oost-Indigo in Pilot Vanishing Point, F (Kangasaurus Hex)

 

[mordorbund]

3 hours ago, zil said:

So these giant dinosaurs were malicious, recognized specific individuals, and wanted to kill them?  Maybe dinosaurs were particularly susceptible to possession by evil spirits

Yes! "And the Lord God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life".

Here's a before picture of the "serpent":

Or a variation:

 

Now I feel like I'm watching Dinosaur Train!

[Sunday21]

List of dinosaurs in ark: Acording to this well researched and respected scientific archive, here is a list of dinosaurs that sallied on the ARK and of course @mirkwood! 

http://www.dododex.com/dinosaurs/aberration

[theplains]

On 8/14/2018 at 1:44 PM, MarginOfError said:

That being said, carbon dating is believed to be accurate to within about 80 years for objects as old as 50,000 - 75,000 years.  If Noah is supposed to have lived about 5,000 years ago, carbon dating could reliably separate the older fossils of dinosaurs from Noah's lifetime. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiocarbon_dating)

I saw this posted on the Internet:

How old is the oldest dinosaur ever found?
Answer: Recent prosauropods from Madagascar are the oldest, about 230 million years old. Until recently, the oldest dinosaur
found was Eoraptor (from Argentina) - it is about 228 million years old. For more information on Eoraptor,

It's amazing how they can speculate it was about 230 million years old instead of 225 million.

Jim
 

[Fether]

On 8/14/2018 at 10:40 AM, zil said:

So these giant dinosaurs were malicious, recognized specific individuals, and wanted to kill them?

I just want to stress a point to argue your comment. How often, in movies with dinosaurs, do we see a massive T-Rex, or any other type of scary dinosaur, leave a massive carcass of freshly killed meat to chase a single or even a couple humans?

It seems to me there is some sort of malicious intent and desire to hunt and kill specifically humans

[Fether]

On 8/14/2018 at 3:30 PM, Sunday21 said:

List of dinosaurs in ark: Acording to this well researched and respected scientific archive, here is a list of dinosaurs that sallied on the ARK and of course @mirkwood! 

http://www.dododex.com/dinosaurs/aberration

I have seen and killed every dinosaur on that list at least once, I can back This claim.