But Mormons Are Christian Too!

[clbent04]

Growing up in the LDS Church I recall members reacting defensively to the statement that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a Christian church.

Does the Church try to position itself as a Christian church or is this more of a cultural thing?

Considering the many atrocities that have been conducted under the banner of Christianity, should the Church even want to position itself as such?

Maybe it's just a matter of semantics, but I recently heard someone share how they don't want to be associated with Christianity, but they are a follower of Jesus. 

[prisonchaplain]

People do a lot of foolish things--sometimes even evil ones--in the name of their God. Some of these have been Christians. Churches and individuals should want to align with truth. If a church or an individual believes that Jesus is God the Son, then would they not want to identify with the Christian faith?

Jews believe Jesus was a false prophet, so they would not call themselves Christians. Muslims believe that Jesus was a true prophet, but that God had no sons--that Jesus is not the Son of God. So, they do not call themselves Christians. Jehovah's Witnesses believe that Jesus is a great prophet, a great teacher, and that he is God's son--but not equal to Jehovah--perhaps a god. So, they deride "Christendom," and want nothing to do with it.

LDS, while not trinitarian, do believe that Jesus is the Son of God. How closely the church wishes to align with the greater Christian movement remains an open question.

[NeuroTypical]

I am a Christian, in that I'm a follower of Jesus Christ and take His name upon me and try to be His disciple in all I do.  My whole life I've encountered people who disagree with my claim, and feel the need to tell me in both words and actions.  I've learned that's their problem, not mine.  

Here - let me shift into wokespeak and talk like a victim for a minute: I like to remember that the name "Mormon" is a reclaimed slur, with no small amount of persecution linked to it.  From my group's creation, we've been marginalized, discriminated against, sometimes outright oppressed and even murdered.  Our claim to follow Christ was so offensive to some, they denied us the claim, and called us "mormonites" or "mormons".  It was a word shouted at us in contempt and anger as they drove us off our lands, burned our crops, killed our leader, and forced us to flee for our lives in the middle of winter when there weren't even heated cars or Starbucks yet, because they hadn't been invented.  We reacted to the name with the same attitude of pre-revolutionary-war settlers reacted to being called "Yankee Doodle" by the British military overseers.  They proudly sang "Yankee Doodle Dandy", and Connecticut even made it their state anthem.  Similarly, we took the name so much to heart, that every decade or two our Prophet needs to remind us what the real name of our Church actually is.

[/Wokespeak] 

 

Things are better these days, and stories like this is about as persecuted as I get:

Quote

My ward building sits on the main corner of a town so small it's not even a town.  For over 20 years, there's been a nice sign on our property placed there by the community that says "The Churches of [LM's town]".   Under the sign are handpainted shingles for the Catholics, the community church, the Lutheran church.  About 12 years ago, they finally let our church hang our shingle on that sign.  The sign that stood on our property.  The sign we allowed to be placed on our property, even though they wouldn't let us hang our shingle on it for a bunch of years.  

Things are all good now.  As the story was told to me: The community church across the street was in dire needs of some groundskeeping, and put out a call to it's members. Only the pastor and one little old lady showed up, and were doing what they could in the July heat ('80's into '90's).  Across the church in our parking lot, the young men had gathered earlier in the day to go do some service project.  When the YM returned, they saw the little old lady slaving away in the heat, and decided to go over and help for an hour.  That Sunday, the pastor gave a pretty energetic sermon about Jesus washing feet and healing the sick and whatnot, and only one of you people managed to show up, and how Christ's call to service had been answered by one old lady and half a dozen mormon teenagers.  And he would no longer tolerate a single negative word about the Christianity of the church across the street, and y'all ought to be ashamed of yourselves, etc.   Then we got to hang our shingle on the sign.  

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by NeuroTypical

[NeuroTypical]

44 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

Jews believe Jesus was a false prophet, so they would not call themselves Christians. Muslims believe that Jesus was a true prophet, but that God had no sons--that Jesus is not the Son of God. So, they do not call themselves Christians. Jehovah's Witnesses believe that Jesus is a great prophet, a great teacher, and that he is God's son--but not equal to Jehovah--perhaps a god. So, they deride "Christendom," and want nothing to do with it.

I heard that story told differently:

Jews do not recognize Jesus as the Messiah.
Protestants do not recognize the authority of the Pope.
Mormons do not recognize each other in the grocery store on Sunday. 

[LDSGator]

44 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

I heard that story told differently:

Jews do not recognize Jesus as the Messiah.
Protestants do not recognize the authority of the Pope.
Mormons do not recognize each other in the grocery store on Sunday. 

That’s awesome. 

[zil2]

2 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Maybe it's just a matter of semantics, but I recently heard someone share how they don't want to be associated with Christianity, but they are a follower of Jesus. 

By that same logic, they should not want to be associated with humans.  Divide us into pretty much any sub-grouping you like and there's a fair chance that at some point in history, some of that sub-grouping has behaved atrociously.  "Throw the baby out with the bath water" comes to mind.

[LDSGator]

8 minutes ago, zil2 said:

By that same logic, they should not want to be associated with humans.  Divide us into pretty much any sub-grouping you like and there's a fair chance that at some point in history, some of that sub-grouping has behaved atrociously.  "Throw the baby out with the bath water" comes to mind.

Perfectly said

[Carborendum]

2 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Maybe it's just a matter of semantics, but I recently heard someone share how they don't want to be associated with Christianity, but they are a follower of Jesus. 

Yes, it is a matter of semantics.

The term Christian was coined by the Romans to label those who followed Christ.  Makes sense.  In the New Testament, the word that the disciples used was Saints.  So, you have the official name and you have the nickname (sometimes used as an epithet, sometimes merely the common term).

Fast forward to the 1800s:  Latter-day Saints were called Mormons in much the same manner.  He was a pretty decent guy.  As epithets go, we didn't mind it so much.  But we recognize that "Mormon" was not our leader or Savior.  We do not worship him, nor do we look to him for our salvation.

To be called a Christian as one of the early saints or as a modern one is linguistically accurate.  It is a label that means we are followers/disciples of He who was called Christ.  Why wouldn't we want that as our appellation today?

[Vort]

I have an admittedly curmudgeonly attitude toward the "Mormons are/aren't Christians" debate. I think it's misguided, ignorant, and useless. If we're being candid, I agree with the Mormon-haters about the use of "Christian" to describe Latter-day Saints; that is, from their point of view, I think their argument holds water.

From a "traditional" point of view, post-Fall of Rome (more like post-AD 150), Christians were those who believed and accepted certain ideas (e.g. the Holy Trinity) and who disbelieved and rejected as heretical certain other ideas (e.g. premortal life). It's been close to 1900 years that Europe and western societies in general have accepted this definition, and by this definition, Latter-day Saints certainly are not Christians. Which I'm perfectly okay with. I worship the true and living God, about whom I am vastly ignorant but I may know some things about him that most who call themselves Christian do not. Whether they think I'm wrong or right has exactly zero bearing on whether I'm actually wrong or right. To them, the term "Christian" means something that doesn't apply to me. Okay by me. Whatever.

The issue is not that I disagree with them. I simply don't care about their point of view. I know perfectly well whom I worship and to whom I pray. If they want to say that I worship A Different Jesus®, let them prattle on. I don't care. The honest ones among them will recognize the true spirit of Christ, and will probably not say such nonsense. As for the rest, they can and will go to hell with the rest of humanity to meet the god they worship, and I'm willing to leave them to their chosen destiny.

[The Folk Prophet]

3 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Growing up in the LDS Church I recall members reacting defensively to the statement that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a Christian church.

Does the Church try to position itself as a Christian church or is this more of a cultural thing?

Considering the many atrocities that have been conducted under the banner of Christianity, should the Church even want to position itself as such?

Maybe it's just a matter of semantics, but I recently heard someone share how they don't want to be associated with Christianity, but they are a follower of Jesus. 

The home page of the church has a Common questions section and the first question is: Are members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints Christian?

The answer given: Yes! As members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, we believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God and the Savior of the World. He loves us all more than we can imagine. We consider ourselves devoted followers of Jesus. While some of our beliefs are distinct, we believe that through His life, ministry, sacrifice, and resurrection, Jesus Christ saves us from sin, suffering, and death.

[LDSGator]

The entire “Mormons aren’t Christians” debate shows that many non LDS Christians really dislike LDS. I find it sad of course, but I also think it shows that nonLDS Christians are a little…um…dense. 
 

If they were ”wiser” or “smarter” they’d unite with LDS and try to combat the stunning rise of non believers and reach some attainable social goals. Instead, these Christians want to pick fights with LDS. Sad. 

[prisonchaplain]

18 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

The entire “Mormons aren’t Christians” debate shows that many non LDS Christians really dislike LDS. I find it sad of course, but I also think it shows that nonLDS Christians are a little…um…dense. 

We could spend a lot of time on this site talking about the similarities between Christians--especially Evangelicals--and even more especially Pentecostals and LDS. There are many. We mostly share political views, chastity views, and worship of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. We share a love for the Bible. Then again, there are many differences. It could be seen as a show of respect to admit such. I value your beliefs enough not to sweep them under a rug or to pretend they don't matter. As but one example, @Traveleroften responds to my posts by saying he respects me as a person but has serious disagreements with my content. To me, that is high regard. He values me enough to affirm character but also enough to engage with my ideas rather than diminish them. 

Okay--some Christians are dense. Their manner of communication is clumsy, unnecessarily confrontation, and too often angry. Others may seem nice but come across as disingenuous. I sometimes wish we could just agree to disagree and focus on matters we admire. However, sometimes having respectful disagreements is more sincere. 

[LDSGator]

1 hour ago, prisonchaplain said:

We could spend a lot of time on this site talking about the similarities between Christians--especially Evangelicals--and even more especially Pentecostals and LDS. There are many. We mostly share political views, chastity views, and worship of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. We share a love for the Bible. Then again, there are many differences. It could be seen as a show of respect to admit such. I value your beliefs enough not to sweep them under a rug or to pretend they don't matter. As but one example, @Traveleroften responds to my posts by saying he respects me as a person but has serious disagreements with my content. To me, that is high regard. He values me enough to affirm character but also enough to engage with my ideas rather than diminish them. 

Okay--some Christians are dense. Their manner of communication is clumsy, unnecessarily confrontation, and too often angry. Others may seem nice but come across as disingenuous. I sometimes wish we could just agree to disagree and focus on matters we admire. However, sometimes having respectful disagreements is more sincere. 

I get it, and I agree. But I can’t be naive bro. I feel super sorry for LDS down here. People know nothing about the LDS church, except that they “aren’t Christians.” When you ask them “Why?” You usually don’t get an answer! 

[Ironhold]

9 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Growing up in the LDS Church I recall members reacting defensively to the statement that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a Christian church.

Does the Church try to position itself as a Christian church or is this more of a cultural thing?

Considering the many atrocities that have been conducted under the banner of Christianity, should the Church even want to position itself as such?

Maybe it's just a matter of semantics, but I recently heard someone share how they don't want to be associated with Christianity, but they are a follower of Jesus. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_and_the_English_Language

As author George Orwell notes, people will attach meanings to words that the words themselves don't actually have and make judgements based on this. 

By saying that we're not a "Christian" church, critics are expecting their audiences to believe that we don't worship Christ. 

[clbent04]

4 hours ago, Ironhold said:

By saying that we're not a "Christian" church, critics are expecting their audiences to believe that we don't worship Christ. 

Every time I've looked into a situation like this, the critic typically doesn't dismiss that the LDS Church believes in Jesus Christ; they discredit the Church as a Christian church due to not being trinitarian.

[zil2]

8 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Every time I've looked into a situation like this, the critic typically doesn't dismiss that the LDS Church believes in Jesus Christ; they discredit the Church as a Christian church due to not being trinitarian.

But there are a lot of people still who know nothing about the Church other than "Mormon" and "LDS" or "Latter-day Saint" - but usually just "Mormon".  And those people are convinced by the words of the people you mention that "Mormons aren't Christians".  Because usually, the people you mention don't bother to say something like, "They say they believe in Jesus Christ, but they don't believe in the trinity."  Rather, they say something like, "Mormons aren't Christians."

[Traveler]

18 hours ago, LDSGator said:

I get it, and I agree. But I can’t be naive bro. I feel super sorry for LDS down here. People know nothing about the LDS church, except that they “aren’t Christians.” When you ask them “Why?” You usually don’t get an answer! 

One of the biggest problems with discussions of critical topics is that terms being talked about often have different meanings within the parties trying to make their point.  If we debate the question of weather or not LDS are Christian – before we try to have a resolution me must first come to an agreement of what exactly defines a Christian.

Many traditional Christians hold to the idea that Christians are defined by the decree from the Nicene Creed of the Trinity that there is only one (singular one) G-d and that anyone that is a poly theist or does not believe in the “Christian” one and only G-d – is not really a Christian.  Others hold to the idea that the Christianity is defined by a community of Christians and not by a singular church – but that this community officially recognizes each other, their common doctrines and ordinances such as baptisms. 

Because of the LDS doctrine that all humanity are divine offspring of G-d (spiritually and physically in G-d’s likeness and image) and therefore potential g-ds themselves that LDS are poly theists and cannot qualify as Christian.  Also, because LDS do not accept the ordinances of baptism from the community of Christian churches that we are not of the community of Christians.

Since we do not positively align with what many define as Christians – to them we are not Christian.  The problem with attempting to argue with these kinds of Christians is the more me make our point – the more they are convinced that we are not Christians.  I do not believe that we should fault them in their assessments.  In a similar manner we believe that until an individual covenants with G-d and accepts the ordinances of baptism (by immersion for the remission of sins) by someone with the authority of the priesthood and receives the gift of the Holy Ghost (by covenant through the laying on of hands) again by someone with the authority of the priesthood (our 4th Article of Faith) – they are not actual or official disciples of Christ and cannot obtain eternal life with G-d the Father in the eternal Kingdom of Heaven.   All of which is why we build temples and do work for the dead.

I appreciate the attitude of @prisonchaplain that is willing to concede that G-d will reconcile and determine who is Christian at some point after we die and come before Him to account for who we are.  Rather than argue specific points of our belief we can trust that G-d will intercede on behalf of those that he will claim for his own and that He is the one that determines who is His.  That we can discuss such points of our doctrines but in faith we can trust that G-d’s insights are just and true – that even those that are Muslem, Buddhist, Hindu or whatever are all “created” by G-d in his image and likeness and as such we can accept all humanity and love and respect, accepting them as G-d loves and accepts them. 

 

The Traveler

Edited October 10, 2023 by Traveler

[Emmanuel Goldstein]

23 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Growing up in the LDS Church I recall members reacting defensively to the statement that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not a Christian church.

Does the Church try to position itself as a Christian church or is this more of a cultural thing?

Considering the many atrocities that have been conducted under the banner of Christianity, should the Church even want to position itself as such?

Maybe it's just a matter of semantics, but I recently heard someone share how they don't want to be associated with Christianity, but they are a follower of Jesus. 

It depends on our definition of Christian? If you mean belief in the trinity, then no, we are not christian. We are followers of the Way of Christ, like the ancient followers of Christ called themselves.

[prisonchaplain]

15 hours ago, Ironhold said:

By saying that we're not a "Christian" church, critics are expecting their audiences to believe that we don't worship Christ. 

As one who has sat in those audiences, I'll bring up the nuance that may prove your point. We (Evangelicals) knew that LDS worship Christ, but we were meant to understand that this Jesus was so different than the one we worshipped that it was, from an Evangelical perspective, not Christian. The sticking point was whether Jesus was essentially one with God or whether He was/is perfectly one with God in purpose. For our teachers, Jesus' essential place in the Godhead was a non-negotiable. 

[zil2]

18 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

For our teachers, Jesus' essential place in the Godhead was a non-negotiable. 

It is for us, too.

[Ironhold]

31 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

As one who has sat in those audiences, I'll bring up the nuance that may prove your point. We (Evangelicals) knew that LDS worship Christ, but we were meant to understand that this Jesus was so different than the one we worshipped that it was, from an Evangelical perspective, not Christian. The sticking point was whether Jesus was essentially one with God or whether He was/is perfectly one with God in purpose. For our teachers, Jesus' essential place in the Godhead was a non-negotiable. 

Toyota, as a company, is officially a Japanese automobile company.

But they have a truck factory here in Texas, one of several factories they have outside of Japan. 

If I was to talk about how Toyota brought jobs to the United States and how certain Toyota vehicles were in fact "all-American", most people would have no idea what I was talking about. If I was to tell them that Toyota Tacoma trucks are perhaps even more common in my part of Texas than anything Ford or Chevy, they'd likely be convinced I was lying. That's because they don't know about the plant down in San Antonio, and likely haven't also factored in the various people employed by the various Toyota dealers across the nation. To them, Toyota is, indeed, a Japanese company because that's where the headquarters facility is and where the company was founded. They wouldn't understand unless I explained it to them, assuming of course they hadn't actually taken offense and decided to ignore me. 

That's the situation we're in. Most people believe things to be just so, and as Orwell warned this includes assigning definitions to words that may not be the definitions that other people use. 

(Seriously. All vehicles made after a certain period are required to indicate where certain parts were made and where final assembly took place. Check your vehicle and the official paperwork.)

edit - 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Tacoma#Third_generation_(N300;_2015)

The third generation Tacoma vehicles were assembled in San Antonio as well as two factories in Mexico. It's been confirmed that the fourth generation will be made in Mexico, but no word yet on if production will continue in San Antonio. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Tundra

The Tundra, however, is indeed exclusively made in San Antonio. 

Edited October 10, 2023 by Ironhold

[JohnsonJones]

2 hours ago, prisonchaplain said:

As one who has sat in those audiences, I'll bring up the nuance that may prove your point. We (Evangelicals) knew that LDS worship Christ, but we were meant to understand that this Jesus was so different than the one we worshipped that it was, from an Evangelical perspective, not Christian. The sticking point was whether Jesus was essentially one with God or whether He was/is perfectly one with God in purpose. For our teachers, Jesus' essential place in the Godhead was a non-negotiable. 

I know that is what they SAY, but I would argue it is fundamentally something very different.

Quote

Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith. Which Faith except everyone do keep whole and undefiled, without doubt he shall perish everlastingly. And the Catholic Faith is this, that we worship one God in Trinity and Trinity in Unity. Neither confounding the Persons, nor dividing the Substance. For there is one Person of the Father, another of the Son, and another of the Holy Ghost. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son and of the Holy Ghost is all One, the Glory Equal, the Majesty Co-Eternal. Such as the Father is, such is the Son, and such is the Holy Ghost. The Father Uncreate, the Son Uncreate, and the Holy Ghost Uncreate. The Father Incomprehensible, the Son Incomprehensible, and the Holy Ghost Incomprehensible. The Father Eternal, the Son Eternal, and the Holy Ghost Eternal and yet they are not Three Eternals but One Eternal. As also there are not Three Uncreated, nor Three Incomprehensibles, but One Uncreated, and One Incomprehensible. So likewise the Father is Almighty, the Son Almighty, and the Holy Ghost Almighty. And yet they are not Three Almighties but One Almighty.

By DEFINITION, Trinitarians admit they DO NOT understand nor comprehend what and who they worship.  They can understand and comprehend, but at the same time, by their own admittance (or at least those who believe in the creed above) do NOT understand their deity.

THIS is the core difference.  The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints do NOT state this.  They believe that they CAN comprehend this, and then go further by DEFINING how this is comprehensible.

THAT...I would say is the core sin that some Churches have against ours...or at least in their argument.

THE irony is that they CANNOT actually say we are WRONG, because, once again, as pointed out, they themselves cannot define the relationship itself.

It's like telling someone that you cannot calculate 2+2...you don't know the answer.  You can comprehend that 2+2 exists and is a math problem, but you cannot calculate it.

Then, when someone says that it equals 4...those who cannot figure out the problem say that is absolutely not the answer. 

HOW WOULD THEY KNOW...if they can't do the math...then HOW CAN THEY TELL SOMEONE ELSE they are WRONG?

In the same way, if one cannot comprehend or understand the Trinity, how then can they tell someone else that their belief on how it works is wrong?

In essence, all other things in the creed are also things that the LDS church promotes.  There is MISUNDERSTANDING on the part of many Saints in that they also do not comprehend the similarities, but going down the list, they essentially believe the same as the Trinitarians with the exception of the comprehensible portion.

They believe that Humanity is of a different substance than the immortal Deity.  That what made Christ special is that for a brief while he shared a PART of this substance of mortality, but he was at first Divine (Being a Spirit and composed of it without any blood, the same as the Holy Spirit is, and as the Father also is not Flesh and blood but Flesh and Spirit...thus being of the Same substance as each other but not mortal as we are) and now also divine (of the same composition or type of body as his Father, being a Celestial Body or heavenly body rather than the Corruptible Mortal Flesh that we are).  Thus he is the same substance, but at the same time, they are all THREE separate individuals (also something we agree upon). 

The question than comes on how we understand the oneness.  IT IS NOT truly defined in the Creed except to show that they are one, and yet three.  In this, the Saints also agree, that they are one and yet three.  The GREAT SIN that those who say it is incomprehensible is that the Saints ALSO say that the way this is achieved is not just due to being of the same immortality as each other (or same substance, as differs from the substance of the mortal man) but also of the same mind, or being one in purpose rather than a more nebulous same brain in all three bodies but also different.  It's that the Saints DARE to define the incomprehensible, or at least attempt to define it.

And for that, many do not accept that the Saints are Christians.

--------------------------------------------

The above is what we see on paper at least, and orally and vocally.  The TRUTH of the matter from my perspective though is that the disagreements ACTUALLY stem from something very different, and the history is that the REAL reasons for the divide today is due to other matters.  The doctrinal reasons are just the excuses that some religions have made up to try to justify the original purpose and reasons of WHY they wished to exclude the Latter-day Saints from being Christians (as if the Trinitarians can be the ones to judge rather than the Lord being the one who actually is the judge).

(though in truth, and ironically, it first goes to the fact that they were polygamists and that offended them early on and so those churches sought ANY excuse to exclude the Latter-day Saints from Christianity, and later it was due to Missionaries converting members of their congregations.  That the Church started converting Christians from one church or congregation into theirs was seen as scandalous and a crusade started among some of the Protestant Churches to stop this.  In around the 60s and 70s you start seeing a massive movement to discredit the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and much of what I've read and heard point out that it was MORE due to the missionary efforts of the Church itself rather than actual theological disagreements at first.  This is when they started truly trying to find theological differences [even turning to those who were anti-LDS at times and spouting truths mixed with lies about the church to their members and anyone who would listen in an attempt to stop those conversions.  It is in some ways...extremely ironic.  I see it as the fore-cursor the current problem that all Christianity in the U.S. are experiencing today, because many of the same things they used to try to dissuade people from converting to the Church could ALSO be used against them.  Many of these are now the arguments which young people are also using against the Christian Majority of Trinitarians on WHY they cannot be part of those Churches.  In essence, those Churches laid the seeds of their own problems for young people falling away from them decades ago).

Edited October 10, 2023 by JohnsonJones

[Carborendum]

2 hours ago, Ironhold said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Tundra

The Tundra, however, is indeed exclusively made in San Antonio. 

My next truck will be a Tundra.

[clbent04]

4 hours ago, Ironhold said:

The third generation Tacoma vehicles were assembled in San Antonio as well as two factories in Mexico. It's been confirmed that the fourth generation will be made in Mexico, but no word yet on if production will continue in San Antonio. 

My 3rd gen 2019 Tacoma was manufactured in Baja California, Mexico. 

1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

My next truck will be a Tundra.

If I got a full size truck I'd probably go with the Tundra as well.

[prisonchaplain]

4 hours ago, zil2 said:

It is for us, too.

"Essential"--meaning of the same essence. Jesus, according to Evangelicals, is of the same essence as God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. For most historic Christians this essential unity is what allows us to say our Trinitarian God is one. LDS theology, as I understand it, says that Jesus is so united with the Father and the Spirit, in purpose, that it is appropriate to say God is one. Essential unity (unity of essence) is not required. This to my understanding, is the key difference. Sadly, some "major on the minors" or want to discuss side issues that are more sensational.