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You can keep it vague and general... In fact it might even be wise. But that limits us to vague and general advise. You have gotten advice and council from your doctor and your bishop... Both whom have acted within their stewardship to council you. Now it is time for you to exert your stewardship over yourself. You are the one that has to live with your choices, you are one that has to face God with your actions. Make a choice... then take it to the lord and see if he approves. If he does then act. If not the discard that and choose a different one. What ever choice the lord approves of... do... but know you will have to face the fall out from such a choice

Wow, this is a massive assumption. You mean because viewing a little porn at night hasn't destroyed the relationship immediately that everything is normal and healthy.... Pornography has no boundaries. Families of all races, beliefs, religion and cultures are being slowly unstitched by this addiction. LDS members can often appear to unravel quicker than others because the addiction is often associated with the breaking of eternal covenants. The church is so concerned about pornography that it has even published a website dedicated to overcoming the addiction.

Why don't you just ask your daughter? M.

I had in mind the bus stop where mothers clutch the babies tightly to their chests, and look at the fellow with a cigarette like he'll instantly transmit lung cancer to her little cherub if he gets within 50 feet of her. But hey, here in Washington the community condemns the evil Tobacco Industrial Complex, but laudes the local, organic marijuana "co-ops." :-)

We're talking libido though, right? Strength of libido is no excuse to action. It's as simple as that. Beyond that, it's impossible to advise specifically because of the lack of detail. I mean, what would you advise if I said I was on a medication that was making me feel homicidal? Go ahead? Kill a few people, it will make you feel better? Of course not. The fact that your doc doesn't see certain actions as sinful does not make those actions acceptable to the Lord.

(slapping head) Thanks for fixing the link. More senior moment than I should be having at my age. I'm not blonde either. No excuse. Good way to stall out a perfectly good discussion: 1) Spell Mormon wrong and 2) Let Lakumi and Jerome have a sword fight while you mess around trying to fix the obvious problem. I still can't copy and paste like I used to though and the quote button doesn't seem to be working either.

The church's advertising campaign has taken some interesting twists and turns over the last few years. I was expecting an ipad to pop up after watching the Easter video. The music, editing etc reminded me of an apple commercial. Yet it's had a lot of hits on the internet over 5million. The I'm a mormon campaign was an interesting one, rock climbers, professional sportsmen, people with interesting careers and families with one or two kids. I would have liked to have seen one with a mother unloading her 7 kids into the church car park, doing up Johnny's shoes, wiping Kelly's nose, hustling everyone along, looking a little frazzled and tired but still smiling. That's what I see most Sundays. I'm a mom of 7, I do my best, life isn't perfect, no it don't fly around in helicopters and yes, I'm a Mormon.

I wonder why animal alphabets teach, "A says a a a a a a ape" and B says b b b b b b bear to teach the alphabet sounds based on the phonetic sounds of the letters and when my son tries to remember W for whale he keeps going back to D for DOUBLE U? It says D but it says w w w w w w whale.

The traditional marriage conflict has turned ugly. Some same-sex marriage advocates have compared their efforts with the overturning of prohibitions against interracial marriage. They press the matter, saying that traditional marriage advocacy should not be tolerated. Hope shines, as one advocate begs to differ. He says that he has advocated for same-sex marraige for many years, but is not now advocating to tolerance towards those who disagree. WOW! http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/04/24/opposing-gay-marriage-doesn-t-make-you-a-crypto-racist.html It's commentary like this that makes me hope that maybe we all can just get along...at least for awhile. :-)

Hello NextElement and welcome to the forum! My 2 cent answers to your questions: As the Bible says, judge them by thier fruits (Matthew 7). I believe the Book of Mormon to be an inspired scripture, so a beleif in Joseph Smith comes along with it. Now, do I think everything Joseph did was inspired or perfect? Heck no!! There's only been on perfect man on this earth, and his name's Jesus. Speaking just as myself, I don't know and really don't care. I've never found God is a pile of old bricks, or scraps of pottery, either in the Americas or Middle East. Even if I could know 200% some dude name Jesus lived at this house, it wouldn't prove that he was the Son of God or rose from the dead. I just don't feel the need for such 'proof'. Rather, my my relationship with God is derived from reading His words and openning my heart up to him in prayer. My favorites are Amos 3:7 ("Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets"), and the books of Isiah and Revelations which make many references to phrophets proclaiming the Word in the last days. There are others too-- feel free to ask if you want more. Question for you: what verses would you use to say that Jesus was the last of the prophets? I've heard non-LDS sources say John 19:30 ("It is finished"), but to me that verse has always resenated as "it" = His suffering, since He died right afterwards. Obviously His work wasn't done, because He came back, taught the people many things, and is coming back again. Other posters have already nailed this one. Useful officail answer: https://www.lds.org/topics/becoming-like-god 1) LDS services don't have a rock band so don't expect one ;P. This probably isn't a big deal for someone of Catholic background, but I have many non-denomational friends who honestly don't feel like it's church without an electric guitar. Rather, LDS services are of the philiosphy that God speaks with a quiet reverant voice, so they try to emulate that. 2) There will be screaming babies. While LDS try to be revent while worshiping God, worship is a family event so there are babies and kids... and they can only be kept so quiet. 3) On a more serious note, keep an open heart and mind, I've attended services at many churches (Christain and not), and even though I've never converted to any of them, I've always learned something about them, myself, and God. 4) If you want to know the logistics of a Mormon church service, this is a really good link:

The experience will not be the same for anyone. Everyone's relationship with the Lord is their own, and the Lord knows what they need. Some get an answer easy. Some struggle with it. But the Lord has promised us that if we will sincerely seek, we shall find. Consider James 1:5, and then consider Moroni 10:3-5 (as estradling75 suggested). In my case, having been born into a Mormon family, I had grown up on the Book of Mormon and stories of Joseph Smith. When I finally got serious about knowing I did pretty much just as you said. I knelt down and said, essentially "Is this true?" I received a witness from the Holy Spirit in response, and since that time have received that powerful witness again and again. I advocate the study of archaeology behind the Book of Mormon. It's fascinating. It will support one's faith. But if one approaches it from a negative point of view, it can also tear down faith, just like the anti-bible claims. As with all matters of faith, the "proofs" out there can tear it down or support it. The Lord does not intend for us to have proof of that nature because it would be destroyed by His standard that we live by faith. So I do not think the Book of Mormon will ever be proven to be true (and the Bible as well). The Lord wants us to seek him in faith.

Honestly it really just depends on the people. My whole life I've only brought one guy home to meet the family (he is also the only one my family has ever even heard me talk about!). I also drove 8hours to meet his mum and moved two states to be by him. However! Marriage is not really anywhere near the picture for us. So yes big sacrifices can be made on both ends but it doesn't mean serious or marriage. I'd personally ask your daughter to elaborate more on her statement.

I've been deliberately slow to reply in this thread because the responses infuriate me. So let me be extremely blunt, church. You're talking about things you simply do not understand. You have had multiple people on here with deep, personal experiences with pornography addiction (and addiction in general) talk about how this isn't about sexual fulfillment, but about control and stress. You've largely dismissed those statements because you believe that it is about sexual fulfillment. Here's a newsflash for you. If you want to know what it is that drives people to use pornography, talk to the people that are driven to use it. They generally have a far better understanding of what motivates them to turn to porn than someone who has been fortunate enough to escape its bitter clutches. Pornography use and especially pornography addiction is very much like nicotine addiction. It takes the typical smoker over 12 attempts to give up cigarettes. Do they enjoy smoking? Yes and no. People who want to give up smoking enjoy the feeling they get when they are smoking, but they hate that they can't give it up. Without the drug, they are irritable, more stressed, have trouble concentrating. When they have the nicotine in their systems, they are calm and more focused. The continue to smoke because the short term craving for the calm and stress management consumes their will for the long term benefits they objectively know come from a smoke free lifestyle. Simply put, they haven't mastered their cravings. They haven't bridled their passions. It's incredibly hard for them to master these cravings because it means giving up peace of mind for so long while the mind and body retrain themselves. I get why the church speaks so harshly against pornography. It's far easier to go without it if you never get started on it. And while the rhetoric around avoiding it is correct (SpiritDragon was correct when saying that it starts out as a sexual curiosity), by the habitual use is established, the motivations are no longer the same. Which is why it concerns me that the LDS dialog around pornography is full of descriptions of covenant breaking, filth, and the jeopardized exaltation. But pornography use is no more condemning to a person's soul than tobacco use, coffee use, alcohol use, or profanity. Yet, pornography use is the only one that gets reviled so strongly. The net effect of all this vitriol toward pornography is that those most in need of help are afraid to come forward and ask for the help they need. I'm not joking one bit when I say that I have heard too many women say that they would leave their husbands if they found out he used pornography. Men who are found out to be pornography users are seen as perverts, deviants, and some leaders will even disqualify them from serving in callings, particularly with youth and children. Think about what message that sends to someone who is struggling with this challenge. And then ask yourself this: why don't we treat alcoholic, coffee addicts, and smokers with the same level of disdain. No one here has claimed that it is okay to view pornography. We've all condemned it. And yet people still criticize us for "tolerating the sin" because we seek to temper the dialog about it. This is hurtful to people who are struggling with these addictions. It's deeply hurtful. Because the kind of rhetoric we hear over the pulpit is "it's evil evil evil evil EVIL!!! avoid it! oh and if you fail repent right away." It makes it sound like it should be so easy to repent of. but it just isn't easy. The difficulty of overcoming these addictions is almost never, ever appreciated in talks against pornography. And then you come in with your "it's always about sex. food addiction is always about eating" garbage. Again, try listening to the people that have been experiencing it. I once watched a show about food addiction and listened to people talk about how they ordered large amounts of food from a drive thru then went to a secluded alley where they could sob while consuming their drug of choice. It was not about the food. It was not about the eating. It was about the emotional and physical reprieve that came about because of the eating. Habitual pornography use is not about sex. Sexual release is just the vehicle to get to the emotional and physical reprieve desired. Until you can learn to separate the vehicle from the desired feeling, you will remain ignorant of what truly motivates the addict. So please. Just spare us already.

But which end?

I would pose the same question back to you concerning your beliefs. How can you be so sure that Moses was a prophet, had a vision, and didn't just make up his stories in the bible? It's a matter of faith. As you will learn in exploring The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, we strongly believe in personal revelation. They reason I believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet and that the Book of Mormon was not made up by him is because I took the matter to the Lord and asked. Lack of evidence is not evidence. There are various apologetic explanations for things, as varied as the questions, but it comes down to the same matter as the previous question. There are archaeological evidences of the Book of Mormon and there are archaeological unknowns. Archaeology is not the reason that I believe the Book of Mormon to be true. Because I know the book is true through my faith, I can look for what archaeological evidences there are for support, and I can not stress too much about the things that have not been found yet. Amos 3:7. If there are no prophets, God will do anything. So, no prophets = God doing nothing. What verses in the bible say there will be no prophets after Jesus? I presume you refer to the parable in Matt 21? Short answer, we do not believe in the tradition of the trinity. We believe that when the bible speaks of God and Jesus being one that it means one in purpose. There is no teaching anywhere that speaks of God living on another planet. We do believe in deification, but...well...read this. Becoming Like God. Enjoy it. There's nothing too overwhelming about it. Just listen and learn and try to be sensitive to the Spirit.

Possibly. Half truths are one of Satan's most powerful tools. And diplomacy is always beneficial. I see this as diplomacy. It gives a way in for those who, as he stated, refuse to even have the dialog because they are accused of racism. It opens up opportunities for some consideration of homosexuality and gay-marriage that might otherwise not be open. Yes, I agree, the tactic could be considered biblical. How many organizations and leaders through the ages have picked and chosen from certain biblical principles to sway their followers to an evil end though? Good and evil are not so black-and-white. Should we view every kind approach as good? If I am kindly swaying you to murder your brother, does it qualify as praiseworthy?

He has very little to gain by expressing tolerance towards traditionalists. In fact, he'll like get some rather sever push back from the LBGT activists. Even if his motive is to play nice to win a few of us over, I'd suggest his tactic (if not his position) is blblical.

Because I did a typo. It should have read "but he is NOW advocating tolerance..."

I don't really care for the blog that much, but I think that the notion that MormOns are fairly normal and go about life in a routine, expected way is helpful in a missionary sense. More people than not are more likely to be interested in a religion that acts as a bonus addition to everyday life than one that weighs one down with cultish behaviors and constrictions. (Amish, Moonies, etc.) We also have the Fundamentalist identity to contend with. Every time they make it into the news it skews the reality of who we are. So I think it's helpful to appear like regular folks. But I draw the line of blending in with the world at lightening up on standards like the Word of Wisdom, chastity, language and such. We HAVE to maintain our peculiarity in these areas or there wouldn't be much reason for the Church to exist. As far as doctrinal normalcy, we need to maintain our beliefs there, too but those beliefs aren't going to show up very much in day to day conversation and in how we interact with people. I think I would act the same way I do if I believed in a different Godhead or if I had no idea what the priesthood was.

What are you looking for? Advice that it's okay to sin because of medication you are on? I'm not seeing anyone advising you that way. Moreover, your details are too vague to truly advise. What is the medication you are on? What is it's purpose? Why can't the medicine be changed or reduced. Details matter.

Mormons are regular people. I don't present myself as other than what I am at work or at home, or at recreation. And aside from not drinking, and not smoking, and being a moral person. I guess I'm pretty normal. What else would there be that would make me not normal. I guess I don't understand the premise? Most people I know love their families, drink in moderation, go to church, try to be faithful to their wife's and girlfriends. I relate to much of how they live.

If you are referring to the "Because of Him" video, I would have to say that I liked it. I found it Christ centered. It showed the present accomplishments of the world comparing them to the amazing accomplishment of God - saving the world. M.

Gordon B. Hinckley seemed to want the world to see Mormons as normal. Mormons are regular people, President Gordon B. Hinckley said during a 1995 interview on "60 Minutes" that thrilled American church members who longed for their neighbors to see them as normal. http://www.deseretnews.com/article/695248252/Gordon-B-Hinckley--Long-legacy.html?pg=all M.

I didn't feel a dissertation on various forms of judgment was necessary given the context of the discussion so far. It seemed to me it was apparent that the judgment being referred to was that judgment concerned with condemnation and company. Of course we need to judge between good and evil, every decision made requires a measure of judgment. As for the "ALL" about aspect of addiction I will have to respectfully disagree. It is about addiction. Satan loves addiction because it is practically a loss of agency. Over-eating, alcoholism, and pornography are addictions first and foremost. Yes over-eating involves food, alcoholism involves alcohol and pornography involves pornography, and yes they come from somewhere. Pornography almost assuredly becomes addictive because of the sexual aspect, but it is also entirely possible for individuals who are addicted to continue the activity even though it brings no perceivable enjoyment whatsoever, they may even lack libido completely but still turn to it, hating themselves for doing so and wondering why they persist when they don't even enjoy it. Going back to the food addiction; Yes it always involves food, but it doesn't follow that it always involves hunger. The same goes for pornography, it always involves pornography, but it doesn't always follow that it is about sex. In any event we need to be loving and understanding of everyone's weaknesses. This is not to say that we accept the sin, it is always wrong to sin, but we love and accept the sinner and seek to help them find a way out. The only lasting deliverance coming from God.

I corrected the link in the OP. As Maureen mentioned normons was spelled incorrectly when the OP put normans.

It looks like a chain link with a green plus sign in the lower right, it's on the second row 8 buttons from the left. I was going to attach a screenshot, but I can't figure out how lol

You need two "o's" in the name. http://www.normons.com/ Also the article: http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865601587/Normons-A-site-to-prove-just-how-normal-Mormons-are.html?pg=all M.

But you are self-admittedly strange... so your concept of normal must be abnormal

Yeah, the link doesn't go to a blog. But as to the question -- if the world sees and LDS person as entirely normal then it's probably an indication that there's something amiss with said LDS person, IMO.

A member of the bishopric here wears a zip up cardigan instead of a suit. It looks like I'll be making a trip to Macy's sometime this week! And I totally forgot about the Distribution Center selling white shirts. I'll look into buying some more there! Thanks!

A few weeks ago I spoke with a person about being a facilitator in the Pornography Addiction Support Group (PASG) in the ARP program and she couldn't really get why anyone is addicted to porn. I tried to explain and she said "oh, so they're weird." Without a thought I replied "they're not weird, they're broken." A few nights ago I spoke with one person who couldn't understand why married men had pornography problems. He figured that since they have a wife to have sex with, then that should take care of the problem. Without a thought I replied "it's not about curbing a sexual desire, it's about control." I get where many will say that they don't understand the anxiety with pornography, many view it out of curiosity. The issue comes when it is viewed as a way to comfort and/or control an emotional reaction either from trauma or the stress of life. So then they view it and, like any other drug, they get desynthesized to what they're seeing. This desynthesization reaches out into objectifying the target of their sexual inclination. When that happens, empathy is gone and they allow pornography to dictate to them how to view and interact with others as well as give them permission to act what can be deemed inappropriate and destructive. So I would ask that if someone does ask for help with a pornography issue, don't dismiss it because they have come to a realization that its no longer a harmless curiocity or fantacy but it has grabbed hold of them and made them powerless to properly deal with relationships and life's stresses.

I have learned the hard way to just let my stylist take care of my roots. Instead of using the root cover ups made by the hair color companies you can get this: http://www.sallybeauty.com/haircolor-touch-up/CLSTEV33,default,pd.html#q=root&sz=60&start=33 Just style your hair and only cover the roots where they are obvious. It will wash out in the next shampoo. The other thing you can do is to get your hair highlighted. I get regular color touched up every 6 weeks and highlights every 18 weeks. The highlights make the roots less noticeable. Also, a haircut with more volume on top helps make the roots less noticeable. We grey early in our family. I've had to color my hair since I was 25. So, I've had a lot of experience!

Whether it be porn or any other sin my view is that we, as members, ought to be less judgmental and more inclined to show sympathy and compassion towards those who are living in sin. Why? Because, believe it or not, every single one of us are living in sin and do we not all beg for mercy, compassion, and acceptance from Heavenly Father? And if we are not begging, do we not at least hope, wish, and wonder if Heavenly Father has mercy and compassion for us? There is a tendency, not universal of course, but a strong tendency in my experience in life for members of the Church to essentially kick the sinner/addict when they are down because they believe they are more righteous than the filthy, perverted porn addict (alcoholic, etc.). I see people in my Ward who are struggling with addictions and I know that in most cases these individuals already feel like crap. They already think they are worthless. They already feel like they aren't worthy to be with members of the Church. So, they don't come to church. They don't participate. They are more inclined to stay away. In some cases their feelings are not justified but in many cases they are because members can and do judge them. What these people need are not overreactions and people preaching to them how horrible they are or how horrendous their actions are (they already know or feel that). What they need is to feel compassion. To know that they are loved and accepted, despite their sins. This is what I want the people I know in my ward who are struggling with addictions to know. I want them to know that its okay to have weaknesses and still come to church. That is what church is for. It is for the weak and the wicked. Come and be with us. We love you. We want you to be healed. Come get strength from joining with those who are struggling just like you are, albeit with maybe different sins and different trials, but we are still relying on the Atonement of Jesus Christ and are begging for mercy like you. I may have a testimony of the gospel and I know the atonement is real but I don't have everything figured out. -Finrock

Yes. that was my take on her point. And I adamantly disagree. Normal is defined by what is common. But healthy? I think that's a stretch. I do not believe that for a second. What is counterproductive to healing is anyone not turning to Christ. Beyond that, to claim that a wife should "ho-hum" their husband's (and within the church, Priesthood holder's) use of pornography does not help. I simply do not buy the, stop-treating-sin-like-it's-a-big-deal-and-everything-will-improve approach. An LDS temple-married husband's use of pornography is a betrayal of his marriage and priesthood covenants. It is a VERY big deal. As to your point, however, I also believe that any wife who threatened to leave their husband over such an issue is in jeopardy of betraying her marriage covenants as well. So, yeah...some overreact. That is not what the church teaches or what anyone should be taking away from the church's teachings on pornography. I have never heard anyone preach that a wife should divorce their husband over pornography. Anyone who is taking that away is misguided as well. And anyone preaching that should be severely reprimanded and corrected.

Sin is irrelevant to it. Little children suffer from both physical death and spiritual death when they leave the pre-existence and must be redeemed from both.

I wonder.........oooooppppppsssss wrong thread

Short answer is yes. There is an obligation unless both parties have circumstances which have been communicated prior to marriage, or if circumstances change during the marriage rendering one or the other incapable. Otherwise, yes there is an obligation.

My wife says that phrase A LOT! Sometimes it's a "justification" she tells herself. Sometimes it is meant as that she is okay with something & she wants to believe God is okay with it as well. Then there is the, you can choose to believe what you want to believe, I choose to believe _____ & we'll know who's right soon enough, until then it's between me & the Lord so quit judging me! So I think it means a little different to each person & most likely each person puts a little twist to what they mean by it depending on the specific circumstances. I think in general it is a way of saying: "Quit Judging Me! That is something between me & the Lord, & does not involve you!"

I think that often it is a way to not have to admit that an individual is wrong. They have taken a stance and when presented with evidence that says otherwise, rather than admit they may be wrong it becomes "it's between me and the Lord. Jerry

It can also be another way of saying we will have to agree to disagree. Often in that context used with the fanatical on some particular issue. A good example would be the members who try and tell the caffeine drinkers that they should not have temple recommends. Sometimes you just want to disengage rather than telling someone they are an idiot.