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RSR is a great book, Bushman is a believer and participated in the writing of the essays that the church released regarding priesthood for blacks and polygamy

I found that differences between Mormons and other Christian denominations all stem from teachings that were restored, e.g. Godhead, Pre-Mortal Existence, Eternal Families, Post-Mortal life... basically when you're looking at the Primary drawing of the Plan of Happiness it's all the circles before Mortal Existence and all the circles after Spirit World. So, let's take "being saved" for example. The rest of Christendom have the Spirit World as the final destination - Paradise or Prison. So, if you think about it, we are actually the same in the belief that FAITH in Christ (accepting Christ as our Savior - proof of which is righteous living) is the only requirement for Paradise. Anything we do beyond that - marriage, temple ordinances, etc. are extra stuff. So, I find, that in order to bridge the gap in understanding, we, as Mormons, have to see the gospel from the prism of "which teachings were restored in the latter-days?" and bear that in mind, whereas the non-Mormons have to see the gospel from the prism of "how does it affect my understanding of the gospel if these restored teachings are true". Make sense?

You mean something like @prisonchaplain's boss?

Huh? Seems like you have a beef with those that can integrate science with religion. I have had my experiences with weird stuff that cannot be explained, along with people I trust and love tell me theirs. Some real, creepy stuff mind you. However, in this case, it does sound like sleep paralyses, which is a real thing. Do you deny what those that have experienced it have said? There have been a good balance on this thread between a scientific explanation and advise on how to deal with it, along with religious, faithful ideas that could help. I wonder how many people thought that having a child born with mental illness meant that they were possessed? But now, you can accept that they aren't right? Faith and living the gospel can help in any situation, whether it is scientifically explained or not.

Thanks for the advice, I have bought the book anyway, so I will let you know what I think when I have read it. Thank you also for your concern but I'm a grown women with a degree who is getting a little annoyed at everyone in the Church treating me like a child. Ive been an active Church attender all my life and been a church Warden. I also read quite a bit about Church history before I got baptised and some was from anti sources.. Still got baptised, i think a book like this will strengthen my testimony tbh.. We shall see I suppose lol.

I recently had a Christian ask me what the deal was with Muslims and Jews. It reminded me of a conversation I had with an imam once. He asked why we (Evangelicals) seemed to favor Jews over Muslims, since Muslims consider Christ a true prophet, and Jews say he was false (based on the Talmud)? My answer came down to the reality that once the sonship and deity of Christ are denied, the other nuances do not matter much. Anatess2 is spot on, in suggesting that it is the LDS prophetic revelations the contain the major gaps in our faiths. The insight is helpful to an extent. It certainly points to wear our common beliefs will lie--from the point of creation to the point of the 2nd coming. I would add that our holiness codes are quite similar--especially concerning sexual mores, substance abuse, modesty, etc.

I used to have sleep paralysis as a teenager as well. I couldn't move, I couldn't yell out and there was always that feeling of something extremely evil around me. I finally had a blessing and never had the problem again. But I put up with it for a long time before I finally had my dad give me a blessing.

Welcome to the wonderful world of Sleep Paralysis. I'm a card-carrying member, so is my dad, so is my brother, so is my son. Seems like it runs in the family... The first thing I advice is to always say your prayers before going to bed. The next thing is to offer a prayer to Heavenly Father in the name of Jesus Christ when you find yourself in sleep paralysis. The next thing I encourage you to do is to talk to your doctor and describe your sleep paralysis experience. He will most likely refer you to a sleep specialist that will do some testing to rule out narcolepsy. If you don't have narcolepsy, then sleep paralysis is uncomfortable, sometimes scary, but it shouldn't deprive you of good health. Here's some tips to lower the incidences of sleep paralysis (my family has a consistent pattern - we used to experience a lot more of these as teen-agers and it slowly tapers down as one gets older): 1.) Try to lower your stress levels. 2.) Try to get an uninterrupted good night's rest - at least 6 hours. 3.) When you experience it, don't panic. Relax your body (prayer helps with this). If you can go back to sleep even better. 4.) If you feel like your choking, try to control your breathing by taking shallow but very even breaths and work towards breathing a bit deeper as your body relaxes. 5.) If you see demons, don't panic. Offer the prayer while relaxing your body to distract the focus from the dark presence. If the presence is still there after the prayer, you can try counting sheep (make your mind focus on what the sheep's face look like while counting). So... I don't want to dismiss your demonic experience or minimize it in any way. I just want to explain my experience and my research on the matter: Sleep paralysis occurs when you cycle through REM sleep (that stage in sleep where your mind is most active) and your body and brain goes out of synch. So, during REM, your brain goes very active and so your brain shuts down your body so that your body won't respond to the brain stimulus and cause you to do dangerous stuff in your sleep. At this stage, your brain goes into dreamland - but your body doesn't do anything about it because it is paralyzed. The problem occurs when the REM cycle completes and your brain wakes up but your body has not received the signal yet to get out of paralysis mode. So your brain and body gets out of synch. There is only one solution to this and it is to wait for your body to get in synch with your brain. What you do while waiting determines your experience (whether it's cool or scary or reverent or invited demons, etc.)... Sleep walking is another one of those where the body and the brain go out of synch in a REM cycle. The brain paralyses the body while it goes through dreamscape but something goes awry so the body doesn't get paralyzed, it starts to respond to brain stimulus instead. Hope this helps.

https://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/124.29-31?lang=eng#28 ...and really, just keep reading to the end of the section. Verse 43 confirms that the Lord said where to build it, and the whole section makes perfectly clear that he wants a house built (in other words, not just anywhere will do - except in poverty, and then only temporarily, and even then, the Lord told them where was / was not OK). See also: https://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/57.3?lang=eng#2 https://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/84.3?lang=eng#2 It seems clear to me that if the Lord is intimately involved in the building of his temples. And then there's this: https://www.lds.org/scriptures/nt/mark/14.4-6?lang=eng#3 https://www.lds.org/scriptures/nt/john/12.3-7?lang=eng#2 https://www.lds.org/scriptures/nt/matt/26.7-10?lang=eng#6 "There is enough and to spare," the Lord has told us. I think we should trust him on this.

http://www.fox5dc.com/news/175723691-story http://www.nbc-2.com/story/32468834/brian-rice-trial-highest-ranking-officer-cleared-in-freddie-gray-death

Yeah I understand they think they are doing what is best but all it does is facilitate this atmosphere where you feel you can't ask questions which is why I come on line so often. I find it quite sad that I have no one i can talk about spiritual matters with in the flesh.. In my old Church, debate was encouraged to strengthen ones faith. Still I go to Church to worship God. I can study at home.

He's a chaplain ministering to inmates in a prison. In the US, the person "in charge" of a prison is usually called a warden (who would not be the chaplain's boss, at least, I assume not, but it makes for a good joke).

Sadly I don't think that it is... However I wasn't commenting on American politics... I was commenting about those of us who prefer to wait until the investigation has run and the verdict is in before judging people... When we talked about waiting on the cops to see what the court say... we were accused of hating the poor, hating blacks etc... Now that is done... But now it flipped to the prosecutor.. and as people like me say wait and see what the courts say... we are going to be accused of hating the police. Not because our principle stance has changed but because too many are about their team and will flip flop just like you described.

That's a reasonable way to put it. I only know Baltimore firsthand (and Washington DC) so while I suspect it's the same in other large cities, I can't claim to know from personal experience. Baltimore is a pit, largely because they keep electing leaders who keep the poor where they are and then blame their political opponents for those problems. Kinda like Detroit, only Baltimore has better geography so it's helped, but that isn't due to any competence on the part of elected officials there.

Heh this is 21st Century American politics, my friend. It doesn't mean that at all. What will happen in time is that when the result comes in, half the people who have been watching the story will feel vindicated and the other half will see it as evidence that the system doesn't work. The only difference will be which half is which.

I almost think they have so embraced their emotions over principle and logic that they have lost their self-awareness and are in the process of de-evolving. Do they ever stop to consider how absolutely disgustingly bigoted, racist and classist they are. I'm grateful to look at my mixed kids and their cousins and know that the desperate leeching of every area of division by these race mongers eventually has to end and everyone will realize how vapid and tired their arguments are. http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2016/07/27/black-dnc-protest-tells-crowd-white-people-to-back.html

Yes, it is one of the most worthwhile books I've read about Mormons, outside church publications. I hesitate to recommend it for new members, as I have said above. But it's worth owning and reading, for Mormons who want depth beyond the usual Sunday School level of history. It's the kind of book that's worth re-reading over the years.

You might be interested in the discussion thread from the book club forum about this book. Here's a linky (hope it works).

It's interesting that KK's name isn't mentioned as being involved in this.

I'll take it 5 times if you'll come spend 1 week in and around Baltimore with me.

"I have never wandered even for a few months from church activity. I have held many positions in our basically lay-run church from scoutmaster to bishop, stake president, and patriarch." Mormon Scholars Testify: Richard Lyman Bushman

PP canceled this: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/utah-planned-parenthood-scraps-condoms-with-mormon-symbol/

CONGRATS from me too! What really helped me as a new convert is inviting the missionaries over for dinner as often as I can. I scheduled New Member Discussions with our Home Teacher too. I was also given a calling teaching RS a week after I got baptized and my husband would help me prepare for the lesson.

I actually made a list of big topics diverging LDS beliefs from generic Christianity-- Metaphysics of who God is. But the Love of God and roles of creator, Christ the Savior, etc are pretty in common. Metaphysics of who we are. But the need of God's Love, saving, repentance, etc are pretty in common. Continuing revelation / open cannon. But the sacredness of the Bible is pretty in common. Eternal families. I had thought about putting "ordinances" or "priesthood" on the list, and it would be so if this was comparing vs generic Evangelical beliefs, but less so when with Catholics (though who is a priest, the nature of priesthood, and the ordinances do greatly differ). Similarly, considering the wide variety of "how is a person saved" beliefs in mainstream Christendom, I wasn't wanting to put that on the list... but also because when more deeply examined, I find these beliefs are much less different than what they appear on the surface.

I'm curious why you feel you need to be nice. Some people don't understand nice. You can be blunt and assertive without being mean, but you don't have to be nice about it. Now, if you kicked him in the groin while emphasizing your point, well....

When they make me emperor of the world, everyone will be required to run through some of this before they can get a high school diploma. Then I'd make Unixknight do it twice, just 'cuz I'm emperor and that's how I'd roll.

I'm gonna be upset if George RR Martin would be debilitated or die before he delivers that book he promised.

I love the book RSR, but I don't think of it as a book for brand new members. The church is true and Joseph Smith was a prophet. However, sometimes new members have their faith shaken when the learn that the church and its prophets aren't perfect. Only Jesus was perfect. But he uses us imperfect people to do his work. And he uses the church to teach us to become more perfect. Also, some new members have trouble accepting Joseph Smith's polygamy, because it is so different from their own cultural background. Polygamy is in the Bible; for example Abraham did it. Joseph Smith did polygamy because God commanded him to. It's an example to us of submitting to God even when he asks us to do something we don't understand at the time. Joesph Smith was amazing. I love to read his words. It's clear to me that he was a prophet, and I feel the Holy Spirit telling me this when I read Joseph's words. I recommend the RSR book whenever you feel ready. But you might want to read the church books such as Truth Restored first. The church institute manuals are also great for getting more knowledge. And carefully read the Book of Mormon and Doctrine and Covenants, to see what a prophet Joseph was. To get a strong testimony of that first. A final note: The RSR book was written by a historian. He is trying to tell the facts. It is not necessarily trying to build your faith. So be aware of the tone and the purpose of the book when you read it.

It certainly sounds like sleep paralysis. I've experienced it quite a few times - very similar to what Anatess and Pam describe - not with "demons" per se, but with a feeling of panic and inability to move - sometimes a powerful force holding me back against the bed. My wife tells me I make "wimpering" noises when it happens - when she hears me she gives me a nudge and I come fully awake. Sleeping with your eyes open can produce strange effects: a few years ago I was admitted to hospital with acute asthma, and I was lying on one of their trolley-bed things. I was dead-tired but unable to sleep properly because of the effort needed to keep breathing. I went into a kind of miserable doze during which which I clearly saw a woman with a round face looking at me. She was quite beautiful, with long dark hair; a bit like Anna Ford in her younger days. As I gradually woke up the face changed until it became the rivet in the side of the bed, and I realized that was what I had been looking at all along. I can only suppose is that the dream-state does strange things to the information we receive from our senses. I also once read an article* which suggest that Fuseli's painting "The Nightmare" is a representation of sleep paralysis: the ugly fella on the sleeper's chest is the force holding her down. (The most scary part of the painting for me is the nasty-looking horse in the background - some suggest is the steed the demon arrived on - probably combined with the pun of "mare" in "nightmare"). *I don't know if this is the same article but it says much the same as the one I'm referring to: http://www.thesleepparalysisproject.org/about-sleep-paralysis/culture-and-history/

http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/27/us/baltimore-marilyn-mosby-officer-lawsuits-freddie-gray/ Five of the cops are now suing over the matter.

Or maybe they realized that if the matter went to court they'd get smacked down so hard the entire Utah chapter would be in danger of collapse from the legal fees and penalties.

since all the good ones have already been taken, I'll just say congrats

Thank you, Pam! Well said.

People start conversations on a forum when it's a subject that is of interest to them. Others have the choice to just scroll on by if it is something that doesn't interest them at all. Might I suggest that be the case in the future? Let those who do have an interest have a conversation regarding the topic.

@LeSellers How is it that so often you turn a thread that was nothing more than something meant to be fun into something that brings debate and contention? It happens quite often.

No questions thanks.. I have no doubt that Joseph Smith was a prophet and also a man with flaws. I thought this might strengthen my testimony, i borrowed the Church history Dvd out the library, and it good (I always end up crying watching Church dvds) but looking for something a bit more in depth due to what I've read before.

A simple prayer usually does the trick too.

Are you asking why is it necessary to be physically sealed (either yourself or in proxy), or why is it is necessary to be sealed in general? I'll try to answer both... When I was married (my husband is non-LDS), I made a vow to him: a vow to always be by his side, to romantically love him and no one else, to be open and honest with him, and share everything I am/have with him. Did I already plan on doing that before we married? Yes! But my vow on that wedding day formalized my commitment to him, making me formally responsible for upholding it, and formally entitled to the benefits from it. Going through that process further solidified our bond with eat other. Honestly, I do hope my husband comes to embrace the gospel one day and we can be sealed together. I hope we will formally make a vow to God, declaring our desire and willingness to be a couple for the eternities. Did we already plan on being the best we can before God? Yes! But our vow on that sealing day will formalize our commitment to God, making us formally responsible for upholding it, and formally entitled to the benefits from it. As to a sealed couple being "above" a non-sealed one-- A sealed couple is not automatically "better" than a non-sealed one. Rather a couple that has Christ activity in their lives is more blessed and more responsible for their actions than one which does not. Why? Because having Christ is your life brings blessings & responsibilities! Furthermore committing yourself to Him brings even further blessings & responsibilities!

Hello Reece, This isn't an answer to your question; although it will be something to ponder relating to your question. All your questions have resulted from the disobedience of the sons and daughters of God since Adam and Eve bore their first child. If all of the sons and daughters of God, since Adam, loved the Lord more than they loved this world these type of questions would not exist. They exist as a result of disobedience. There wouldn't be a need for missionaries as all the sons and daughters would be members. There wouldn't be any thoughts regarding separated families (divorced) as this wouldn't have occurred. When Adam first went out into the wilderness he was given a command. When the angel visiting asked why he followed, his response, I know not save the Lord commanded me. These are questions which will fall under the same category (because it has not been revealed" and individuals have been telling you what has been revealed. A merciful and loving God will work out all things, at this moment though, like Adam, we move forward -- although not knowing the whole purpose -- in light of what has been commanded knowing that God works everything out. Returning back to the same questions, which cannot be adequately answered at this time, which means we move forward in faith knowing that at some time the questions will be answered and we will then know. Our responsibility is to move forward, like Adam and Eve, even when we do not know. That is faith. That is hope. That is charity toward God.

It's not the questions that lead to the apparent conclusion, it's more the way you present them. You seem to be saying that the Temple covenants of sealing have no real value. That's not at all correct. No one will be exalted without them. They happen in the Temples and no where else. They happen under the authority of the keys of the Priesthood, and by no other men. Those are absolutes. They cannot be changed, not even by God Himself (except, when we're too poor to build a Temple, He can dedicate a place for that purpose temporarily). No one has all the answers. Please don't take offense at the wording of this almost-a-joke, but the Jewish sages say that one fool can ask more questions than ten wise men can answer. In this case, it means that we can ask questions that we cannot understand the answers. Asking the questions isn't wrong, it's just futile. We have tried to answer as best we can. No, the answers are not perfect, and they are certainly not complete. But, as far as I can tell, they are correct within the limits of what we know. Lehi

We read in Mosiah that the priests of Noah had to teach the Lamanites the "language of Nephi". Admittedly, this could have meant that they needed to teach them to write, not speak, it because the next few verses talk about their writing. BTW, this is the only place in scripture that mentions government-run, tax-funded welfare schools. And it ain't for good reasons. And thus we see … Lehi

Some more good info on this topic: Question: What was the Lamanite curse? http://en.fairmormon.org/Book_of_Mormon/Lamanites/Curse/What_was_it Race on the Priesthood https://www.lds.org/topics/race-and-the-priesthood

Bingo Sunday! "Captain Moroni, working to free Nephite prisoners, sends wine to their Lamanite guards, hoping to intoxicate them (Alma 55). Because they would not accept such a gift from a Nephite, Moroni finds a Lamanite in his own troops, a former guard of the Lamanite king. Accompanied by other Nephites, this soldier takes the wine to the guards, and Moroni’s plan is successful. Of significance is the fact that Moroni had to “search” for a Lamanite soldier. Had he been “black” in contrast to the “white” of the Nephites, his identity should have been readily apparent. Furthermore, on his mission to the guards, Nephites accompany him. A color difference should have immediately been apparent to the guards, but they do not notice the discrepancy. The best explanation for needing an authentic Lamanite is that Moroni needed his language skills, not his skin color, for the ruse."

The word "black" in the AV Old Testament represents several different Hebrew words. This is more than merely academic. We do not know which word(s) Joseph saw on the plates. Lehi

I think where some go too far, is in suggesting that there was never any visible/ethnic/genetic difference at all. Racism in the Book of Mormon was a thing, and was condemned by at least one Nephite prophet (Jacob 3:5, 9).

Firearms are not "designed to kill people". They are designed to launch projectiles at whatever the users points them at. If the user points one at a person, it is the person who chooses to kill, not the firearm. Further, while owning a firearm does not require taking classes and a test, having insurance, etc., neither does owning a car or truck. Even using a firearm or a truck does not require any of these, either, as witnessed by the inordinate number of people arrested for driving without a license or a revoked license (which, itself, indicates the criminal has demonstrated irresponsibility as a driver). So, we see that laws limiting the use of cars by the unlicensed do not stop unlicensed driving. Other laws do not stop speeding, failing to stop at stop signs/lights, or reckless driving of any sort. How, then, would gun regulations stop evil people from misusing firearms? The problem with this point of view is that any proposed gun regulation would do nothing to stop the very thing you and I and anyone else here hate. Your sister would be at the same risk with or without the gun control you desire. The issue is evil, not firearms. Evil, like truth, will out. How about this: instead of banning guns so that good people cannot access them for legitimate purposes, we require that a high school diploma require 90% pass on still targets, 100% pass on a written test on proper firearm usage, and 90% on a fire-no fire range? You seem to think that classes make us safer behind the wheel; why not with firearms? Lehi

It is perhaps worth remembering that "history" does not refer to past events, but to the record of past events. History is, above all, a "story". In this sense, history can change. It can even be wrong. In general, our understanding of the past is only as good as our histories of it. In this sense, Rough Stone Rolling may be as good a "secular" history of Joseph Smith as we can hope for. But whatever other people may have said about Joseph Smith and whatever the historical records might seem to indicate, these things do not affect to any degree the reality of what happened. And we may be (and very likely are) sealed off from that reality throughout mortality. So in topics such as these, the best and safest course is to gain a testimony and follow the Spirit in all things. Insofar as they are true, histories can be very useful; but since false histories in such a topic can be not merely damaging, but damning, we are much better off not basing our beliefs on various histories, but rather on a confirmation of the Spirit. That said, it's probably a great book. I have two copies waiting to be read, some time in the future when I have loads of time to read for pleasure.